CW/CW-REV config option

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CW/CW-REV config option

k1htv
Am I the only one who prefers to tune 'Up the Band' into a CW signal rather than
from a frequency above a CW signal to receive it? Apparently not, since there is
a 'CW-REV' button on the K3 as well as on many other radios.

Over the past 5 decades, I've become accustomed to tuning in CW stations from
below the signal's transmitted frequency. Not all radios define 'CW' and
'CW-REV' the same way. The Kenwood TS850 and other Kenwood transceivers have the
user tuning into CW signals from below. Using narrow bandwith, a CW signal
quickly disappears as the receiver is tuned above the signal frequency. Icom
radios and the K3 are the opposite, where the 'CW' mode has the user tuning in
CW stations from above the signal's frequency.  Users who wish to tune from
below and into a signal must switch to 'CW-REV'. This is not a problem since the
K3 remembers this preference on each band.

However, when rig controlling software programs such as CT, N1MM, RXCLUS, etc.
are used, every time the 'CW' mode command is sent by the program to the K3, the
radio switches to the 'CW' mode rather that the prefered 'CW-REV' mode.

Would it be possible to have a CONFIG setting which would allow the user to
define 'CW' and 'CW-REV' modes, that is, the way of tuning into CW signal
frequencies (lower to higher or higher to lower)?  If this option was available,
when radio controlling software sent a generic 'CW' mode change to the K3,  it
would respond by switching to the user's prefered way (CW or CW-REV) of tuning
into CW signals.

What say?

73,
Rich - K1HTV

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Re: CW/CW-REV config option

Don Wilhelm-4
Rich,

The K3 CW tuning is the way I like it - tune to a higher frequency and
the pitch of the note gets higher.  It just makes sense to me, and I
hate radios that do it 'backwards'.

73,
Don W3FPR

Rich - K1HTV wrote:
> Am I the only one who prefers to tune 'Up the Band' into a CW signal rather than
> from a frequency above a CW signal to receive it? Apparently not, since there is
> a 'CW-REV' button on the K3 as well as on many other radios.
>
>  
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Re: CW/CW-REV config option

Dunc Carter - W5DC
The CW-REV as configured on the K3 is essentially upper side band
receive which is the way many receivers/transceivers such as my FT-101E
were configured back in the Dark Ages.  I suspect many people are used
to it.  Furthermore, the K3 tunes backwards compared to the FT-101E.  
I've had the K3 since October, 2009 and I seem to have adjusted, perhaps
because the FT-101E hasn't been turned on since I got the K3.  I wonder why?

Dunc, W5DC
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Re: CW/CW-REV config option

Juan EA5RS
In reply to this post by Don Wilhelm-4
Even though it is a matter of personal preference and not really critical, I
agree with Rich, I find it easier to visualize it this way:

higher pitch means the signal is higher in frequency and it fits with
(CW-REV)

you center the signal by turning VFO or RIT up(clockwise),
or center it in your passband if you shift it up (clockwise)
or notch an interferer to the right (clockwise) of the center frequency
(all three match)


If you use plain CW and the signal is high pitch then

you center the signal by turning VFO or RIT down(COUNTERCLOCKWISE),
or center in your passband if you shift it up (clockwise) -well reversed!-
or notch an interferer to the right (clockwise) of the center
(not all three movements match)


Juan,
EA5RS/EE5E

-----Mensaje original-----
De: [hidden email]
[mailto:[hidden email]] En nombre de Don Wilhelm
Enviado el: jueves, 29 de abril de 2010 23:58
Para: Rich - K1HTV
CC: [hidden email]; [hidden email]
Asunto: Re: [Elecraft] CW/CW-REV config option

Rich,

The K3 CW tuning is the way I like it - tune to a higher frequency and
the pitch of the note gets higher.  It just makes sense to me, and I
hate radios that do it 'backwards'.

73,
Don W3FPR

Rich - K1HTV wrote:
> Am I the only one who prefers to tune 'Up the Band' into a CW signal
rather than
> from a frequency above a CW signal to receive it? Apparently not, since
there is
> a 'CW-REV' button on the K3 as well as on many other radios.
>
>  
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Re: CW/CW-REV config option

wb6rse1
In reply to this post by Don Wilhelm-4
For DXers, the standard for CW has always been USB. IE a higher pitch tone means a station higher in frequency. Very useful when looking for the "spot" when the DX is split and listening up. Also standard. CW USB on the K3 is indeed CW REV. LSB CW, for DXing,  is considered backwards. To each his own.

73 - Steve WB6RSE


On Apr 29, 2010, at 2:58 PM, Don Wilhelm wrote:

The K3 CW tuning is the way I like it - tune to a higher frequency and
the pitch of the note gets higher.  It just makes sense to me, and I
hate radios that do it 'backwards'.

73,
Don W3FPR

Rich - K1HTV wrote:
> Am I the only one who prefers to tune 'Up the Band' into a CW signal rather than
> from a frequency above a CW signal to receive it? Apparently not, since there is
> a 'CW-REV' button on the K3 as well as on many other radios.

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Re: CW/CW-REV config option

Paul EI5DI
This post has NOT been accepted by the mailing list yet.
In reply to this post by k1htv
<quote author="Rich - K1HTV">

"Would it be possible to have a CONFIG setting which would allow the user to
define 'CW' and 'CW-REV' modes, that is, the way of tuning into CW signal
frequencies (lower to higher or higher to lower)?  If this option was available,
when radio controlling software sent a generic 'CW' mode change to the K3,  it
would respond by switching to the user's prefered way (CW or CW-REV) of tuning
into CW signals".

Rich has described the problem very well, and I support his proposal.
Some other rigs, such as the Icom ProIII, have this as a user-selectable
menu option.

73,
Paul EI5DI


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Re: CW/CW-REV config option

Claude Du Berger
In reply to this post by k1htv
I am using CW-REV on my K3 with N1MM.
On N1MM: Config/mode Control   = Select Use Radio Mode (Default)

73


  ----- Original Message -----
  From: Rich - K1HTV
  To: [hidden email]
  Cc: [hidden email]
  Sent: Thursday, April 29, 2010 5:42 PM
  Subject: [Elecraft] CW/CW-REV config option


  Am I the only one who prefers to tune 'Up the Band' into a CW signal rather than
  from a frequency above a CW signal to receive it? Apparently not, since there is
  a 'CW-REV' button on the K3 as well as on many other radios.

  Over the past 5 decades, I've become accustomed to tuning in CW stations from
  below the signal's transmitted frequency. Not all radios define 'CW' and
  'CW-REV' the same way. The Kenwood TS850 and other Kenwood transceivers have the
  user tuning into CW signals from below. Using narrow bandwith, a CW signal
  quickly disappears as the receiver is tuned above the signal frequency. Icom
  radios and the K3 are the opposite, where the 'CW' mode has the user tuning in
  CW stations from above the signal's frequency.  Users who wish to tune from
  below and into a signal must switch to 'CW-REV'. This is not a problem since the
  K3 remembers this preference on each band.

  However, when rig controlling software programs such as CT, N1MM, RXCLUS, etc.
  are used, every time the 'CW' mode command is sent by the program to the K3, the
  radio switches to the 'CW' mode rather that the prefered 'CW-REV' mode.

  Would it be possible to have a CONFIG setting which would allow the user to
  define 'CW' and 'CW-REV' modes, that is, the way of tuning into CW signal
  frequencies (lower to higher or higher to lower)?  If this option was available,
  when radio controlling software sent a generic 'CW' mode change to the K3,  it
  would respond by switching to the user's prefered way (CW or CW-REV) of tuning
  into CW signals.

  What say?

  73,
  Rich - K1HTV

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Re: CW/CW-REV config option

Bob McGraw - K4TAX
In reply to this post by k1htv
There is one radio on the market that I am aware of that uses UCW and LCW
thus with the press of a button you have either of your choices.  Your
preference doesn't seem at all strange to me.  The software that I use to
control the radio offeres UCW and LCW modes.



73
Bob, K4TAX


----- Original Message -----
From: "Rich - K1HTV" <[hidden email]>
To: <[hidden email]>
Cc: <[hidden email]>
Sent: Thursday, April 29, 2010 4:42 PM
Subject: [Elecraft] CW/CW-REV config option


> Am I the only one who prefers to tune 'Up the Band' into a CW signal
> rather than
> from a frequency above a CW signal to receive it? Apparently not, since
> there is
> a 'CW-REV' button on the K3 as well as on many other radios.
>
> Over the past 5 decades, I've become accustomed to tuning in CW stations
> from
> below the signal's transmitted frequency. Not all radios define 'CW' and
> 'CW-REV' the same way. The Kenwood TS850 and other Kenwood transceivers
> have the
> user tuning into CW signals from below. Using narrow bandwith, a CW signal
> quickly disappears as the receiver is tuned above the signal frequency.
> Icom
> radios and the K3 are the opposite, where the 'CW' mode has the user
> tuning in
> CW stations from above the signal's frequency.  Users who wish to tune
> from
> below and into a signal must switch to 'CW-REV'. This is not a problem
> since the
> K3 remembers this preference on each band.
>
> However, when rig controlling software programs such as CT, N1MM, RXCLUS,
> etc.
> are used, every time the 'CW' mode command is sent by the program to the
> K3, the
> radio switches to the 'CW' mode rather that the prefered 'CW-REV' mode.
>
> Would it be possible to have a CONFIG setting which would allow the user
> to
> define 'CW' and 'CW-REV' modes, that is, the way of tuning into CW signal
> frequencies (lower to higher or higher to lower)?  If this option was
> available,
> when radio controlling software sent a generic 'CW' mode change to the K3,
> it
> would respond by switching to the user's prefered way (CW or CW-REV) of
> tuning
> into CW signals.
>
> What say?
>
> 73,
> Rich - K1HTV
>
> ______________________________________________________________
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> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
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>
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>


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Re: CW/CW-REV config option

Joe Subich, W4TV-4
In reply to this post by k1htv

On 4/29/2010 5:42 PM, Rich - K1HTV wrote:
 > However, when rig controlling software programs such as CT, N1MM,
 > RXCLUS, etc. are used, every time the 'CW' mode command is sent by
 > the program to the K3, the radio switches to the 'CW' mode rather
 > that the prefered 'CW-REV' mode.

There is no need to change the K3.  N1MM Logger and other well designed
programs (e.g., DXLab Suite) allow the user to select CW or CW-Rev as
the default when changing bands or "clicking on a spot."  RTFM ...

Why add something more to the K3 that will just provide more chance of
confusing the user when well designed software deals with the radio
just fine as it is?

73,

    ... Joe, W4TV


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Re: CW/CW-REV config option

Don Wilhelm-4
In reply to this post by wb6rse1
Steve,

Interesting -- I never really gave it much thought, except I preferred
LSB CW for the reason I stated - it keeps *my* head straight.  It may be
a thing more common to the QRP community.  Anyway, Wayne designed the K2
and K3 normal CW to be LSB, and the K1 is always LSB.
In the K2, just hold the REV button and it switches sidebands, and on
the K3 the sideband is remembered per band, so that can keep all of us
happy.  If you want it the other way 'round, just hold the REV button,
and you have your preference.

73,
Don W3FPR

[hidden email] wrote:

> For DXers, the standard for CW has always been USB. IE a higher pitch tone means a station higher in frequency. Very useful when looking for the "spot" when the DX is split and listening up. Also standard. CW USB on the K3 is indeed CW REV. LSB CW, for DXing,  is considered backwards. To each his own.
>
> 73 - Steve WB6RSE
>
>
> On Apr 29, 2010, at 2:58 PM, Don Wilhelm wrote:
>
> The K3 CW tuning is the way I like it - tune to a higher frequency and
> the pitch of the note gets higher.  It just makes sense to me, and I
> hate radios that do it 'backwards'.
>  
>
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Re: CW/CW-REV config option

Gary, W7TEA
In reply to this post by k1htv
I agree Rich.  After a string of Kenwood rigs starting with a TS 820S, I've gotten used to tuning from the bottom of the band.  MacLoggerDX allows me to map the program so that clicking on a CW spot delivers CW-R.  

73
Gary W7TEA
73,

Gary W7TEA  K3 #1001, #5763
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Re: CW/CW-REV config option

Ralph Parker
In reply to this post by k1htv
>Am I the only one who prefers to tune 'Up the Band' into a CW signal...
>...when rig controlling software programs such as CT, N1MM, RXCLUS, etc...
>...radio switches to the 'CW' mode rather that the prefered 'CW-REV' mode.
>Would it be possible to have a CONFIG setting which would allow...

My pet peeve too!
I whined about this a number of months ago, and was assured that it was on
the "feature request" list.
Nothing yet - maybe on the next revision (hint, hint).

VE7XF

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Re: CW/CW-REV config option

Ralph Parker
In reply to this post by k1htv
>There is no need to change the K3...
>Why add something more to the K3 that will just provide more chance of
confusing the user...

Well then, let's just freeze the K3 as it is today, and not make further
software or hardware changes.

VE7XF

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Re: CW/CW-REV config option

Don Wilhelm-4
In reply to this post by Bob McGraw - K4TAX
Bob,

If that "one" radio is something other than an Elecraft brand, change
that "one" to "at least 5".  The K2 and the K3 will switch sidebands at
the touch of a button too (actually a hold).  My Yaesu 847 has quick CW
sideband switching as does the FT-817, and my Yaesu FT-900 also allows
the user to select the CW sideband, but it is not as quick and easy as
on the K2 or K3 or the other Yaesus.  I have all mine set to LSB CW!

The Yaesu default is to USB CW, while the K2 and K3 default is to LSB CW
- it is very easily changed - just hold the REV button.
Interaction with logging software may be a different consideration, read
the documentation for your preferred application for the details.  Some
will follow the transceiver settings, while others may try to "do it
their way".  If you have problems with that aspect, contact the software
author.

73,
Don W3FPR

Bob McGraw - K4TAX wrote:
> There is one radio on the market that I am aware of that uses UCW and LCW
> thus with the press of a button you have either of your choices.  Your
> preference doesn't seem at all strange to me.  The software that I use to
> control the radio offeres UCW and LCW modes.
>  
>
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Re: CW/CW-REV config option

Jeff Cochrane - VK4XA
In reply to this post by Ralph Parker
----- Original Message -----
  From: Ralph Parker
  To: [hidden email]
  Sent: Friday, April 30, 2010 9:50 AM
  Subject: Re: [Elecraft] CW/CW-REV config option


  >There is no need to change the K3...
  >Why add something more to the K3 that will just provide more chance of
  confusing the user...

  Well then, let's just freeze the K3 as it is today, and not make further
  software or hardware changes.

  VE7XF


  Then we could call it a KenYaecom!

  Jeff Cochrane - VK4BOF
  Innisfail, QLD
  Australia.
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Jeff Cochrane - VK4XA
Innisfail, QLD, Australia.
K3 #4767
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Re: CW/CW-REV config option

Bob McGraw - K4TAX
In reply to this post by Don Wilhelm-4
No problem here with the radios or the logging software or the remote
control software.  At least there is a choice.

73
Bob, K4TAX


----- Original Message -----
From: "Don Wilhelm" <[hidden email]>
To: "Bob McGraw - K4TAX" <[hidden email]>
Cc: "Rich - K1HTV" <[hidden email]>; <[hidden email]>;
<[hidden email]>
Sent: Thursday, April 29, 2010 6:53 PM
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] CW/CW-REV config option


> Bob,
>
> If that "one" radio is something other than an Elecraft brand, change that
> "one" to "at least 5".  The K2 and the K3 will switch sidebands at the
> touch of a button too (actually a hold).  My Yaesu 847 has quick CW
> sideband switching as does the FT-817, and my Yaesu FT-900 also allows the
> user to select the CW sideband, but it is not as quick and easy as on the
> K2 or K3 or the other Yaesus.  I have all mine set to LSB CW!
>
> The Yaesu default is to USB CW, while the K2 and K3 default is to LSB CW -
> it is very easily changed - just hold the REV button.
> Interaction with logging software may be a different consideration, read
> the documentation for your preferred application for the details.  Some
> will follow the transceiver settings, while others may try to "do it their
> way".  If you have problems with that aspect, contact the software author.
>
> 73,
> Don W3FPR
>
> Bob McGraw - K4TAX wrote:
>> There is one radio on the market that I am aware of that uses UCW and LCW
>> thus with the press of a button you have either of your choices.  Your
>> preference doesn't seem at all strange to me.  The software that I use to
>> control the radio offeres UCW and LCW modes.
>>
>


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Re: CW/CW-REV config option

Joe Subich, W4TV-4
In reply to this post by Ralph Parker

Rather let's not keep adding nit-picking changed to Wayne's list
so he can concentrate on more important items that add functionality
rather than repackage the same old features.

This is, after all, an Elecraft transceiver.  If you want a rig
that operates just like a Kenwood, go buy a Kenwood.  Similarly,
if you want a radio that operates like an Icom, buy an Icom.

It's not a matter of freezing the K3, it's a matter of smart
application of resources and spending time to provide options
to copy the idiosyncrasies of other vendor's user interface is
not a good use of resources.

73,

    ... Joe, W4TV

On 4/29/2010 7:50 PM, Ralph Parker wrote:

>> There is no need to change the K3...
>> Why add something more to the K3 that will just provide more chance of
> confusing the user...
>
> Well then, let's just freeze the K3 as it is today, and not make further
> software or hardware changes.
>
> VE7XF
>
> ______________________________________________________________
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>
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Re: CW/CW-REV config option

lstavenhagen
I would also agree to leave the K3 as-is. I don't see why there needs to be more ways to set USB and LSB.... just hold CW-Rev to get to the other one.....

73,
LS
W5QD
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Re: CW/CW-REV config option

Ted Roycraft
In reply to this post by Ralph Parker
I also thought that Wayne put it on the "feature request" list sometime
last fall.  I hope he did.  CW REV seems natural to me and with some
effort I got Logic 8 to handle it but it would be so much easier, at the
risk of confusing some individuals, if there were a configuration entry
to flip the definitions of CW and CW REV.

I love the people who say "I don't use that - you don't need it - don't
implement it!".  Please, if you don't want it, just don't use it if it
gets implemented.

73, Ted, W2ZK

On 4/29/2010 7:43 PM, Ralph Parker wrote:

>> Am I the only one who prefers to tune 'Up the Band' into a CW signal...
>> ...when rig controlling software programs such as CT, N1MM, RXCLUS, etc...
>> ...radio switches to the 'CW' mode rather that the prefered 'CW-REV' mode.
>> Would it be possible to have a CONFIG setting which would allow...
>>      
> My pet peeve too!
> I whined about this a number of months ago, and was assured that it was on
> the "feature request" list.
> Nothing yet - maybe on the next revision (hint, hint).
>
> VE7XF
>
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Re: CW/CW-REV config option

lstavenhagen
>I love the people who say "I don't use that - you don't need it - don't
implement it!".<

Mostly they're just saying "the rig already does that - RTFM" hi hi.

73,
LS
W5QD
12