Elecraft's source code

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Elecraft's source code

Ken G Kopp
Hi Mike!

Your question has been asked before in several forms.  AFAIK, the answer is
"No", and I hope it remains so.

If you were able to change your Elecraft's "personality" in some way to
make it unique ... regardless of the merit of your change ... it would no
longer really be an Elecraft would it?

If you were to sell your unit ... or need to send it somewhere for repair
... what / who would know what had been altered in the radio's "brains"?

In my view, it would be akin to putting an engine from a Ford under the
hood of a Buick.  The result might well result in an improvement, but the
resulting vehicle would always be an oddity that few would want to deal
with.

Some who own / buy animals pay close attention to the genetics​ of their
critters, and sometimes someone's idea goes wrong.

Then there's the added staff at Elecraft needed to deal with the code
alterations gone wrong in units sent in for "psychiatric" repair.

We place a tremendous amount of confidence in Elecraft based on the
reputation of the company's​ products, and a major portion of that comes
down to the integrity of "the code".

73!

Ken Kopp - K0PP







On May 11, 2017 20:38, "Mike Parkes" <[hidden email]> wrote:

Hello Elecraft group,
I don't own anything made by Elecraft yet however I have been shopping for
an HF rig to get active again (I have been off the air for a number of
years for personal reasons). I really like Elecraft's products, and I am
intrigued by the 'software definable radio' possibilities in this new breed
of amateur radio equipment design.

I have a question though, related to what can or can't be done with an
Elecraft SDR transceiver*. Is the source "code" able to be modified by the
End User?* Or is it proprietary in some way so that only those at Elecraft
can touch the code? I have been monitoring this list for while now and have
yet to read anything like, "hey check out this cool change I made on the
Elecraft KX3 code! Before the radio only did this - now it does this!" and
next thing you know there are some very cool user modified code being made
available. Like, the ham being able to add their call into the code? (see
this
example
<https://spacemodels.files.wordpress.com/2017/05/customized-display-kx3.jpg>
)

73's
Mike AB7RU

PS I tried to send this with the image attached and it got kicked back with
an error message so apologies if is a duplicate email list submission from
me.
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Re: Elecraft's source code

vk2rq
If you want to play around with and learn about SDR, I suggest you build a soft rock kit. Keep your Electaft rig for listening on the bands while you work in the kit :-)

73 de Matt VK2RQ

> On 12 May 2017, at 1:30 pm, Ken G Kopp <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> Hi Mike!
>
> Your question has been asked before in several forms.  AFAIK, the answer is
> "No", and I hope it remains so.
>
> If you were able to change your Elecraft's "personality" in some way to
> make it unique ... regardless of the merit of your change ... it would no
> longer really be an Elecraft would it?
>
> If you were to sell your unit ... or need to send it somewhere for repair
> ... what / who would know what had been altered in the radio's "brains"?
>
> In my view, it would be akin to putting an engine from a Ford under the
> hood of a Buick.  The result might well result in an improvement, but the
> resulting vehicle would always be an oddity that few would want to deal
> with.
>
> Some who own / buy animals pay close attention to the genetics of their
> critters, and sometimes someone's idea goes wrong.
>
> Then there's the added staff at Elecraft needed to deal with the code
> alterations gone wrong in units sent in for "psychiatric" repair.
>
> We place a tremendous amount of confidence in Elecraft based on the
> reputation of the company's products, and a major portion of that comes
> down to the integrity of "the code".
>
> 73!
>
> Ken Kopp - K0PP
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On May 11, 2017 20:38, "Mike Parkes" <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> Hello Elecraft group,
> I don't own anything made by Elecraft yet however I have been shopping for
> an HF rig to get active again (I have been off the air for a number of
> years for personal reasons). I really like Elecraft's products, and I am
> intrigued by the 'software definable radio' possibilities in this new breed
> of amateur radio equipment design.
>
> I have a question though, related to what can or can't be done with an
> Elecraft SDR transceiver*. Is the source "code" able to be modified by the
> End User?* Or is it proprietary in some way so that only those at Elecraft
> can touch the code? I have been monitoring this list for while now and have
> yet to read anything like, "hey check out this cool change I made on the
> Elecraft KX3 code! Before the radio only did this - now it does this!" and
> next thing you know there are some very cool user modified code being made
> available. Like, the ham being able to add their call into the code? (see
> this
> example
> <https://spacemodels.files.wordpress.com/2017/05/customized-display-kx3.jpg>
> )
>
> 73's
> Mike AB7RU
>
> PS I tried to send this with the image attached and it got kicked back with
> an error message so apologies if is a duplicate email list submission from
> me.
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to [hidden email]
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to [hidden email]
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Re: Elecraft's source code

Kevin - K4VD
​I agree with Ken's conclusion that the current answer is, unfortunately,
no. I definitely do not agree with his reasoning. Car analogies aside, if
the code was open for experimentation and improvement by the wider
community then we could all benefit. ​Android, Arduino, Raspberry Pi,
Linux, ... are all examples of things that have been improved because they
can be programmed by just about anyone. Those who don't like your
improvements or don't feel their device will any longer be what they bought
and love can just not install your code changes.

But that's all a moot point as there is no access to the source code. But
unlike many other products, there seems to be pretty quick response to
requests for improvements and fixes.

Elecraft does have pretty rich macro commands allowing some nice external
software to be written. Win4K3 comes to mind. I'm pretty amazed at what has
been accomplished using the available macros. A true API from Elecraft
might improve things even further?

73,
Kev


On Fri, May 12, 2017 at 5:33 AM, Matt Maguire <[hidden email]> wrote:

> If you want to play around with and learn about SDR, I suggest you build a
> soft rock kit. Keep your Electaft rig for listening on the bands while you
> work in the kit :-)
>
> 73 de Matt VK2RQ
>
> > On 12 May 2017, at 1:30 pm, Ken G Kopp <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >
> > Hi Mike!
> >
> > Your question has been asked before in several forms.  AFAIK, the answer
> is
> > "No", and I hope it remains so.
> >
> > If you were able to change your Elecraft's "personality" in some way to
> > make it unique ... regardless of the merit of your change ... it would no
> > longer really be an Elecraft would it?
> >
> > If you were to sell your unit ... or need to send it somewhere for repair
> > ... what / who would know what had been altered in the radio's "brains"?
> >
> > In my view, it would be akin to putting an engine from a Ford under the
> > hood of a Buick.  The result might well result in an improvement, but the
> > resulting vehicle would always be an oddity that few would want to deal
> > with.
> >
> > Some who own / buy animals pay close attention to the genetics of their
> > critters, and sometimes someone's idea goes wrong.
> >
> > Then there's the added staff at Elecraft needed to deal with the code
> > alterations gone wrong in units sent in for "psychiatric" repair.
> >
> > We place a tremendous amount of confidence in Elecraft based on the
> > reputation of the company's products, and a major portion of that comes
> > down to the integrity of "the code".
> >
> > 73!
> >
> > Ken Kopp - K0PP
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On May 11, 2017 20:38, "Mike Parkes" <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >
> > Hello Elecraft group,
> > I don't own anything made by Elecraft yet however I have been shopping
> for
> > an HF rig to get active again (I have been off the air for a number of
> > years for personal reasons). I really like Elecraft's products, and I am
> > intrigued by the 'software definable radio' possibilities in this new
> breed
> > of amateur radio equipment design.
> >
> > I have a question though, related to what can or can't be done with an
> > Elecraft SDR transceiver*. Is the source "code" able to be modified by
> the
> > End User?* Or is it proprietary in some way so that only those at
> Elecraft
> > can touch the code? I have been monitoring this list for while now and
> have
> > yet to read anything like, "hey check out this cool change I made on the
> > Elecraft KX3 code! Before the radio only did this - now it does this!"
> and
> > next thing you know there are some very cool user modified code being
> made
> > available. Like, the ham being able to add their call into the code? (see
> > this
> > example
> > <https://spacemodels.files.wordpress.com/2017/05/
> customized-display-kx3.jpg>
> > )
> >
> > 73's
> > Mike AB7RU
> >
> > PS I tried to send this with the image attached and it got kicked back
> with
> > an error message so apologies if is a duplicate email list submission
> from
> > me.
> > ______________________________________________________________
> > Elecraft mailing list
> > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> > Post: mailto:[hidden email]
> >
> > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> > Message delivered to [hidden email]
> > ______________________________________________________________
> > Elecraft mailing list
> > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> > Post: mailto:[hidden email]
> >
> > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> > Message delivered to [hidden email]
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>
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Re: Elecraft's source code

Elecraft mailing list


I have a mmcHF SDR QRP radio where the firmware is Open Source.

In the beginning the original developer of the radio had his firmware and worked on it then
another basically took over for him and now there is a group of developers working on the code.

You can load the original firmware, or the latest, or even load up the daily build to be on very edge.

Open source tends to allows a much larger pool of talent to look at the code and enhance it.
Additionally bug fixes also tend to get fixed a bit quicker since you have a number of eyes
looking at the code and that tends to allows the spotting of a solution quicker.

But as others have stated, Elecraft's code is Closed Source. I can understand them keeping it closed
source because the radio is basically a consumer product with not a lot of room for experimentation.

Elecraft is in a bit of a Catch 22 because yes with open source they could get the benefits from it
But it could also equate to more "warranty" work for Elecraft when someone messes up their radio.

I have a K3 for my "Nice Radio" and then I have other radios that I mod and play with.
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Re: Elecraft's source code

Jim Brown-10
In reply to this post by Kevin - K4VD
On Fri,5/12/2017 5:34 AM, Kevin - K4VD wrote:
> if
> the code was open for experimentation and improvement by the wider
> community then we could all benefit.

There are two really good reasons why Elecraft should NOT release their
source code and allow access to the inside of the radio. 1) A LOT of
additional resources would be required at Elecraft to address all of the
cans of worms opened by other programmers who don't understand all of
the variables of hardware and software. 2) There's the matter of
intellectual property and the possibility of attempts by others to "rip
off" Elecraft's design. The last thing most of us would like to see are
third world imitation Elecraft radios at a fraction of the cost, simply
because they've copied Elecraft's design, have no design costs, have no
support costs, etc.

73, Jim K9YC

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Re: Elecraft's source code

Ingo Meyer, DK3RED-2
In reply to this post by Elecraft mailing list
Hello Harry,


> Elecraft is in a bit of a Catch 22 because yes with open source they could get the benefits from it
> But it could also equate to more "warranty" work for Elecraft when someone messes up their radio.

I think this is the main reason to "close" the source code. I have seen the problem with
open source on SDR software. Anyone who thinks he could also program or could better
program modify the open source code and spread it. Who uses the modified code and finds an
error with his transceiver/computer, turns to the manufacturer of the hardware and not the
manufacturer of the software.
I like my Elecraft rigs (with the closed source). The developer team tested it and I can
use it without jamming anywhere. Requests flow into the software after weighing.


73/72 de Ingo, DK3RED - Don't forget: the fun is the power!
www.qrp4fun.de - [hidden email]
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Re: Elecraft's source code

John Dolan
In reply to this post by Jim Brown-10
I agree totally with K9YC.

 I work for a computer software company that sells pharmacy software.  We
do not give or Sell source code to our users.  This would open up all sorts
of support issues and allow our competitors to STEAL our lively-hood!

As Elecraft does, we listen to our customer needs and wants and add
features and software enhancements that WE ourselves code into the software.

73, John WB4YAL



*Many of life's problems can be solved by simply deciding what we can do
without. -JohnDolan  <https://www.qrz.com/db/WB4YAL>*

On Fri, May 12, 2017 at 12:39 PM, Jim Brown <[hidden email]>
wrote:

> On Fri,5/12/2017 5:34 AM, Kevin - K4VD wrote:
>
>> if
>> the code was open for experimentation and improvement by the wider
>> community then we could all benefit.
>>
>
> There are two really good reasons why Elecraft should NOT release their
> source code and allow access to the inside of the radio. 1) A LOT of
> additional resources would be required at Elecraft to address all of the
> cans of worms opened by other programmers who don't understand all of the
> variables of hardware and software. 2) There's the matter of intellectual
> property and the possibility of attempts by others to "rip off" Elecraft's
> design. The last thing most of us would like to see are third world
> imitation Elecraft radios at a fraction of the cost, simply because they've
> copied Elecraft's design, have no design costs, have no support costs, etc.
>
> 73, Jim K9YC
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>
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Re: Elecraft's source code

EUGENE GABRY
In reply to this post by Jim Brown-10

> On May 12, 2017 at 11:39 AM Jim Brown <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> There are two really good reasons why Elecraft should NOT release their
> source code and allow access to the inside of the radio. 1) A LOT of
> additional resources would be required at Elecraft to address all of the
> cans of worms opened by other programmers who don't understand all of
> the variables of hardware and software.

This one is an easy one if it were open... A very simply stated statement that any modifications done via re-writes of code are now responsibility of owner, warranty void.

 2) There's the matter of
 > intellectual property and the possibility of attempts by others to "rip
> off" Elecraft's design. The last thing most of us would like to see are
> third world imitation Elecraft radios at a fraction of the cost, simply
> because they've copied Elecraft's design, have no design costs, have no
> support costs, etc.

This one is the heart of not opening the source code. "The secret sauce". All the "me too's" would be out reverse engineering in a heart beat.
From what I have read so far here, there are several options out there with open source codes to play with. Sounds like those would be appropriate sand boxes to play in to satisfy ones creativity. That's also good for creating "good" competition, and forward moving technology.

Gene
N9TF
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Re: Elecraft's source code

Elecraft mailing list
In reply to this post by Ingo Meyer, DK3RED-2

Sadly there are a fair number of people who would screw up their K3 radios and than expect Elecraft to fix them.
On my little mcHF radio I bought it realizing that if I screw it up, then it's up to me to fix it and not blame the manufacturer.








      From: "Ingo Meyer, DK3RED" <[hidden email]>
 To: Elecraft <[hidden email]>
 Sent: Friday, May 12, 2017 1:03 PM
 Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft's source code
   
Hello Harry,


> Elecraft is in a bit of a Catch 22 because yes with open source they could get the benefits from it
> But it could also equate to more "warranty" work for Elecraft when someone messes up their radio.

I think this is the main reason to "close" the source code. I have seen the problem with
open source on SDR software. Anyone who thinks he could also program or could better
program modify the open source code and spread it. Who uses the modified code and finds an
error with his transceiver/computer, turns to the manufacturer of the hardware and not the
manufacturer of the software.
I like my Elecraft rigs (with the closed source). The developer team tested it and I can
use it without jamming anywhere. Requests flow into the software after weighing.


73/72 de Ingo, DK3RED - Don't forget: the fun is the power!
www.qrp4fun.de - [hidden email]
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Re: Elecraft's source code

na5n
In reply to this post by Jim Brown-10
The success of food franchises, from McDonald's to Pizza Hut for example,  
is based on the fact you get the exact same yummy product whether you are  
in Seattle or Boston.  That success is called consistency.  Without that  
consistency, your product reputation suffers.  I see no difference with  
Elecraft or any other equipment manufacturer - all products need to  
function consistently with the same specifications.  Even in the used  
market.  There is no control over your product's performance once outside  
modifications are allowed and under a variety of skill levels, which could  
inadvertently degrade other performance factors of the radio. Pretty soon,  
people are buying used, hacked radios at ham fests or online and find them  
to be a piece of junk.  That seriously hurts a company's reputation for  
their products through no fault of their own.

I think Elecraft's decision for closed-source code is a smart engineering  
and business decision.  It ensures consistency in that every radio, whether  
new or used, functions properly and within specifications.  They keep full  
control of their product's performance and reputation.  And, as we have  
seen, they respond well to customer suggestions for new features or  
capabilities, which are fully company backed.

If you want to hack or custom program an SDR radio, there are platforms out  
there that allows you to do that which can be fun and educational in their  
own right.  If you want an Elecraft radio that works perfectly right out of  
the box, and stays that way, don't mess with it.  If you think it's lacking  
a feature, let them know.

72, Paul NA5N [KX2]
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Re: Elecraft's source code

Guy Olinger K2AV
In reply to this post by EUGENE GABRY
On Fri, May 12, 2017 at 1:09 PM, EUGENE GABRY <[hidden email]> wrote:
> This one is an easy one if it were open... A very simply stated statement that any modifications done via re-writes of code are now responsibility of owner, warranty void.

---------

The truth, sadly, about schemes like this is that the customer,
knowing full well that they screwed it up, will often enough lie
through the teeth rather than admit they did something, and if they
are confronted with the illogic of the claim, will get downright nasty
trying to defend the lie, and then spread the ill-will around.

If the scheme is purely open source, all the way open source, every
time open source, then that experience has its own plusses and
minuses, but everyone gets it.

The problem is that blending open source and proprietary can kill the
advantages of either, and significantly runs up the cost, once all the
cows come home.

Just look at all the 3rd party software issues that get blamed on the
K3/K3S, and hashed out on this reflector. What do you do when the 3rd
party responsible for the software actually is the customer, who
doesn't want to believe they're complicit?

We have such a fortunate situation with Elecraft. I hope they just
keep doing what they're doing.

I'm really pleased they're taking on a 1500 watt solid state amp. That
means they're comfortable that they have solved all the things that
have so far plagued amps over 1000 watts. And even if there is a thing
or two needing mod on that down the road, they'll take care of it
without hanging the customer out to dry.

What a concept. Think maybe "If it ain't broke, don't try to fix it"
might apply to Elecraft's business model and philosophy?

73, Guy K2AV
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Re: Elecraft's source code

NK7Z
Among other reasons, Open Source software packages, even for large well
used packages, that have hundreds of thousands more users than Elecraft
could ever dream of, (like OpenOffice, oh wait, that is dead now, I mean
LibreOffice), have times when there are no maintainers...

I would like to avoid this with my Elecraft, so Open Source is not the
answer here...  In fact, I might have not purchased my K3 if it were
Open Sourced...  The K-Line would turn into a science experiment if it
were Open Sourced.

I also run Linux, as my main OS, and love Open Sourced software, but the
K3 is not the item for it...

73s and thanks,
Dave
NK7Z
http://www.nk7z.net
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Re: Elecraft's source code

Kevin - K4VD
​And we certainly don't want science experiments in ham radio. Oh no.​
Someone might get hurt.

​Someone asked about open source code for Elecraft. Answering him with,
no... you might break something, is a lousy answer.

Companies can choose one way or the other. I'm not arguing that point. It
really is a decision for CEOs and CFOs and owners and bored directors.
While I'm aware of one open source Elecraft project (scary, isn't it) I'm
not expecting them open up their code for all to see. But as a community of
hams I am amazed at how we are shooting this guy's idea down dead. Then
kicking it. Then maybe shooting it again instead of commiserating with him
about all the cool things that might be missed because things are closed.

73,
Kev, K4VD
Reforming Curmudgeon
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Re: Elecraft's source code

Jim Brown-10
On Fri,5/12/2017 1:46 PM, Kevin - K4VD wrote:
> But as a community of
> hams I am amazed at how we are shooting this guy's idea down dead. Then
> kicking it. Then maybe shooting it again instead of commiserating with him
> about all the cool things that might be missed because things are closed.

I'm at least as big a curmudgeon as anyone, but I've also made my living
as a systems engineer for 30+ years and in pro sales for more than ten.
This discussion is about "the big picture," which Elecraft has proved
over and over again that they really understand that. I've been watching
them for 15 years, and I've yet to see them make a marketing decision
that I'd rate less than very good.

Ham radio is a very broad hobby. Elecraft sells products targeted to the
needs and desires of hams they have identified as "their customers."
Elecraft has chosen to NOT open their code or their radio. That's the
product they are selling and that we are buying. Those who want to write
code for their radio are not in that target group. If you want an open
source radio, buy one of several other products that are available.

73, Jim K9YC

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Re: Elecraft's source code

EUGENE GABRY
In reply to this post by Kevin - K4VD
The really cool thing is, anyone with enough ambition, curiosity, and knowledge, can do the exact same things as what the entrepreneurs at Elecraft did from "scratch". And the really, really cool thing with that could be new ground breaking technology and innovations. I would never look at a closed door as missing out, but a challenge to find a work around. In that process better ways are always found, and that keeps the pressure on everyone to do better.  


73 Gene

N9TF  

>
>     On May 12, 2017 at 3:46 PM Kevin - K4VD <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>     And we certainly don't want science experiments in ham radio. Oh no.
>     Someone might get hurt.
>
>     Someone asked about open source code for Elecraft. Answering him with,
>     no... you might break something, is a lousy answer.
>
>     Companies can choose one way or the other. I'm not arguing that point. It
>     really is a decision for CEOs and CFOs and owners and bored directors.
>     While I'm aware of one open source Elecraft project (scary, isn't it) I'm
>     not expecting them open up their code for all to see. But as a community of
>     hams I am amazed at how we are shooting this guy's idea down dead. Then
>     kicking it. Then maybe shooting it again instead of commiserating with him
>     about all the cool things that might be missed because things are closed.
>
>     73,
>     Kev, K4VD
>     Reforming Curmudgeon
>
>     ______________________________________________________________
>     Elecraft mailing list
>     Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>     Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
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>
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>     Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>     Message delivered to [hidden email]
>
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Re: Elecraft's source code

NK7Z
In reply to this post by Kevin - K4VD
Respectfully, you are wrong, and sarcasm is not beneficial to making
your point.  Further, there is no need for you to go all digital on
this...

Clearly I did not say all science experiments are bad, please review my
post, and view it in the context it was offered in and not via the
filter of some alternate quantum universe, where we can only have, all,
or nothing, with no idea which is not in the extreme rebutted with a
sarcastic answer.  If you have a point to make, please state it clearly,
not sarcastically.

Again, respectfully, for me, and I suspect most of us in the normal, non
quantum universe, saying Open Source might break something is perfectly
acceptable.  Here is an example...  Open Source the NASA launch commit
software, then crawl into the next manned vehicle for launch and see how
comfortable you are...  Again, context is everything...

Here again, an extreme viewpoint on your part-- I am not "shooting
anyone down dead", and I don't think others are, I am offering an
alternate viewpoint, and opinion as to why I believe Open Sourcing the
code for a commercial in production, well know, well respected radio,
with a stellar reputation is a bad idea.

If one takes everything in the extreme, then everything looks extreme.
Think context...  When you respond in the extreme it polarizes the
entire issue...  CONTEXT is everything.

73s and thanks,
Dave
NK7Z
http://www.nk7z.net

On 05/12/2017 01:46 PM, Kevin - K4VD wrote:

> ​And we certainly don't want science experiments in ham radio. Oh no.​
> Someone might get hurt.
>
> ​Someone asked about open source code for Elecraft. Answering him with,
> no... you might break something, is a lousy answer.
>
> Companies can choose one way or the other. I'm not arguing that point. It
> really is a decision for CEOs and CFOs and owners and bored directors.
> While I'm aware of one open source Elecraft project (scary, isn't it) I'm
> not expecting them open up their code for all to see. But as a community of
> hams I am amazed at how we are shooting this guy's idea down dead. Then
> kicking it. Then maybe shooting it again instead of commiserating with him
> about all the cool things that might be missed because things are closed.
>
> 73,
> Kev, K4VD
> Reforming Curmudgeon
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>
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Re: Elecraft's source code

Elecraft mailing list
In reply to this post by Kevin - K4VD
Kev, I can't agree more with you, excellent response. I'm also amazed with some of the responses under this thread. I wonder what their reaction would have been if back in the day Yaesu or Kenwood had sold them an hermetically sealed radio to keep them from experimenting with their radio as they see fit or stealing their trade secret. I would argue that's actually a little against the spirit of ham radio. BTW, since the new generation of SDRs perform all main functions, such as modulation, mixing,filtering, etc. numerically within a chip, experimenting with their firmware/software will be pretty much the main way to tinker with these radios. However, I totally understand the decision to use open source is a business prerogative of Elecraft, which is the reason why I also have an Apache Labs radio to experiment with. That platform has many volunteer developing firmware and software and, after frequent updates, nothing has gotten broken beyond repair thus far. 😉

73,
Robert-KP4Y/W4



Sent from my iPhone

> On May 12, 2017, at 4:46 PM, Kevin - K4VD <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> ​And we certainly don't want science experiments in ham radio. Oh no.​
> Someone might get hurt.
>
> ​Someone asked about open source code for Elecraft. Answering him with,
> no... you might break something, is a lousy answer.
>
> Companies can choose one way or the other. I'm not arguing that point. It
> really is a decision for CEOs and CFOs and owners and bored directors.
> While I'm aware of one open source Elecraft project (scary, isn't it) I'm
> not expecting them open up their code for all to see. But as a community of
> hams I am amazed at how we are shooting this guy's idea down dead. Then
> kicking it. Then maybe shooting it again instead of commiserating with him
> about all the cool things that might be missed because things are closed.
>
> 73,
> Kev, K4VD
> Reforming Curmudgeon
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to [hidden email]

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Re: Elecraft's source code

Eric Swartz - WA6HHQ, Elecraft
Administrator
In reply to this post by na5n
Let's close the source code thread now in the interest of reducing list overload
for our other readers.

This is a repeat of several prior threads that are easily read via the Nabble
list archive, which can be reached via:

http://www.elecraft.com/elist.html

73,
Eric
Moderator
/elecraft.com/


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Re: Elecraft's source code

Edward R Cole
In reply to this post by Ken G Kopp
Been reading the mail on this topic.

My take is that the K3 and K3S do not provide external access to the
IQ digital stream so one cannot run any other software on a computer
interconnected to the radios.  Firmware is held under Elecraft
control and not open source, and one would have to download using the
Elecraft Utility.

Had the K3 provided IQ access my dual-pol adaptive receiver design
would have been simpler/easier.

But listening to their customer base, Elecraft provided external
interface of KX3 IQ baseband audio so one could try any number of SDR
programs in one's computer (interconnected thru the soundcard to the
radio).  KX2 may also provide this (I am not enough familiar with
details for this radio).

I have not made the IQ interface for my KX3 (as yet), but will do so someday.

But as others have pointed out, several SDR are now out in the market
which one can "play with" open source sw.

73, Ed - KL7UW
   http://www.kl7uw.com
Dubus-NA Business mail:
   [hidden email]

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Re: Elecraft's source code

NK7Z
I would LOVE an I/Q port on my K3!

73s and thanks,
Dave
NK7Z
http://www.nk7z.net

On 05/13/2017 12:26 AM, Edward R Cole wrote:

> Been reading the mail on this topic.
>
> My take is that the K3 and K3S do not provide external access to the IQ
> digital stream so one cannot run any other software on a computer
> interconnected to the radios.  Firmware is held under Elecraft control
> and not open source, and one would have to download using the Elecraft
> Utility.
>
> Had the K3 provided IQ access my dual-pol adaptive receiver design would
> have been simpler/easier.
>
> But listening to their customer base, Elecraft provided external
> interface of KX3 IQ baseband audio so one could try any number of SDR
> programs in one's computer (interconnected thru the soundcard to the
> radio).  KX2 may also provide this (I am not enough familiar with
> details for this radio).
>
> I have not made the IQ interface for my KX3 (as yet), but will do so
> someday.
>
> But as others have pointed out, several SDR are now out in the market
> which one can "play with" open source sw.
>
> 73, Ed - KL7UW
>   http://www.kl7uw.com
> Dubus-NA Business mail:
>   [hidden email]
> ______________________________________________________________
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