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K3S losing swr-wattmeters indications on tx - please help

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K3S losing swr-wattmeters indications on tx - please help

IK4EWX
I own a great K3S from a pair of months. It work great, dx, qsos, contest (just worked CQWPX, 1200 qsos).
Just after bought it, sometime on cw transmission  the swr-rf indications, the moving black dots, gone all blanked, all on the swr and on RF indications.
I thought about rfi problems, but it happened even with dummy load. And with no swr on antenna.
With atu inserted is seemed more rarely happen.
This morning I have this problem happen at least on 14-18-21-24-28mhz, keying the rig with my bug, only with long dash and not with dots string.
It is a rainy cloudy day, but I think that doesnt matter :)
When using the paddle with internal keyer I havent the problem.
It seem to happen only when keying at least 2-3 seconds long.
When it happen, with the two measurements blanked, the rig really continue to transmit - I see regular power on my external Bird 43 wattmeter.
Somebody had this problem and know how to solve it?
Many thanks
Ian IK4EWX
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Re: K3S losing swr-wattmeters indications on tx - please help

lstavenhagen
Yes, both my K3 and a K3s do this when I key them with my bugs or with my straight key. Even my K2's will behave strangely, though not quite as bad as the K3 and s. It's not a problem with the rig; it's just a contact bounce issue, so you'll just need a debouncing circuit. Either an external keyer (most of them have debouncing circuitry in them) or you can home-brew one. There are a couple good circuits in the list archives.

A capacitor across the bug terminals will help, say a .1 uf, but beware that it'll key the rig momentarily when you first plug it in as the cap charges.

73,
LS
W5QD
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Trying to gauge interest

Ken Arck
Hello fellow 10 watt K3 owners!

As my main use for my K3s is 6 meter and 144 EME operation, I bought
the 10 watt version without the antenna tuner. I dabble a little on
HF but not a whole lot. As such, the 10 watt, no tuner version suits
my needs, although I thought it would be nice to be able to select 2
different antennas from the front panel (one for HF and the other for
6 meters). Spending several hundred dollars for the KATU seemed a bit
overkill to me just to get front panel selection of 2 antennas.

So looking at the schematic, I saw how easy it would be to modify my
KANT board to allow 2 antenna selection. I bread boarded up my
schematic and It works exactly as I expected.

So I'm debating having some pc boards made to replace the entire KANT
board but only if there is enough interest to justify doing so and I
wanted to see how y'all felt about it. I project the bare boards
would run around $20 to $25. You would take the parts from your
existing KANT and reuse them on this new board, in addition to adding
around $12 worth of new parts. So for under $40, you could have dual
antenna selection on your non-KATU equipped K3.

Any interest?

Ken
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
President and CTO - Arcom Communications
Makers of repeater controllers and accessories.
http://www.arcomcontrollers.com/
Authorized Dealers for Kenwood and Telewave and
we offer complete repeater packages!
AH6LE/R - IRLP Node 3000
http://www.irlp.net
"We don't just make 'em. We use 'em!"

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Re: Trying to gauge interest

Lewis Phelps
In reply to this post by lstavenhagen
Count me in!!!

Lew N6LEW

> On Jun 19, 2016, at 11:56 AM, Ken Arck <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> Hello fellow 10 watt K3 owners!
>
> As my main use for my K3s is 6 meter and 144 EME operation, I bought the 10 watt version without the antenna tuner. I dabble a little on HF but not a whole lot. As such, the 10 watt, no tuner version suits my needs, although I thought it would be nice to be able to select 2 different antennas from the front panel (one for HF and the other for 6 meters). Spending several hundred dollars for the KATU seemed a bit overkill to me just to get front panel selection of 2 antennas.
>
> So looking at the schematic, I saw how easy it would be to modify my KANT board to allow 2 antenna selection. I bread boarded up my schematic and It works exactly as I expected.
>
> So I'm debating having some pc boards made to replace the entire KANT board but only if there is enough interest to justify doing so and I wanted to see how y'all felt about it. I project the bare boards would run around $20 to $25. You would take the parts from your existing KANT and reuse them on this new board, in addition to adding around $12 worth of new parts. So for under $40, you could have dual antenna selection on your non-KATU equipped K3.
>
> Any interest?
>
> Ken
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> President and CTO - Arcom Communications
> Makers of repeater controllers and accessories.
> http://www.arcomcontrollers.com/
> Authorized Dealers for Kenwood and Telewave and
> we offer complete repeater packages!
> AH6LE/R - IRLP Node 3000
> http://www.irlp.net
> "We don't just make 'em. We use 'em!"
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>

Lew Phelps N6LEW
Pasadena, CA DM04wd
Elecraft K3-10 / KXV144 / XV432
Yaesu FT-7800
[hidden email]
www.n6lew.us

Generalized Law of Entropy: Sooner or later, everything that has been put together will fall apart.





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Re: Trying to gauge interest

ab2tc
Hi,

Is there any reason why this should not work with a K3/100 also? BTW, how do you convince the firmware that an ATU is installed? When I press "ANT" on my ATU-less K3/100 I get the message "NO ATU". If both these concerns can be put away, count me in, too. I have always been bummed that I can't get two antennas without installing the ATU which I do not want to do. I consider an ATU to be part of the antenna system and should be installed as close to the antenna as possible (my KAT 500 is at the far end of a 100' coax run).

AB2TC - Knut

PS. If this is a double posting, I apologize. I *hate* hot keys.
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Re: Trying to gauge interest

Ken Arck
If you look at the schematics of the KATU, you'll see the chain of
shift registers on the KATU actually sends a signal back to the RF
board. So the CPU sends the command to the KATU and if the ATU
doesn't respond (via the MISO3 line), the CPU interprets that to mean
the KATU isn't present

As for handling 100 watts, I don't see a problem as I use the exact
same OMRON relay the KATU does and I considered inductance in the pc layout

Ken




At 11:34 AM 6/19/2016, ab2tc wrote:

>Hi,
>
>Is there any reason why this should not work with a K3/100 also? BTW, how do
>you convince the firmware that an ATU is installed? When I press "ANT" on my
>ATU-less K3/100 I get the message "NO ATU". If both these concerns can be
>put away, count me in, too. I have always been bummed that I can't get two
>antennas without installing the ATU which I do not want to do. I consider an
>ATU to be part of the antenna system and should be installed as close to the
>antenna as possible (my KAT 500 is at the far end of a 100' coax run).
>
>AB2TC - Knut
>
>PS. If this is a double posting, I apologize. I *hate* hot keys.
>
>
>
>--
>View this message in context:
>http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/K3S-losing-swr-wattmeters-indications-on-tx-please-help-tp7618984p7618999.html
>Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
>______________________________________________________________
>Elecraft mailing list
>Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
>This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>Message delivered to [hidden email]

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
President and CTO - Arcom Communications
Makers of repeater controllers and accessories.
http://www.arcomcontrollers.com/
Authorized Dealers for Kenwood and Telewave and
we offer complete repeater packages!
AH6LE/R - IRLP Node 3000
http://www.irlp.net
"We don't just make 'em. We use 'em!"

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

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Re: Trying to gauge interest

Wes Stewart-2
In reply to this post by ab2tc
Looks like you can tell the K3(S) that the ATU is installed and the ANT1/ANT2
option is enabled:-)

I might be interested too.

On 6/19/2016 11:34 AM, ab2tc wrote:

> Hi,
>
> Is there any reason why this should not work with a K3/100 also? BTW, how do
> you convince the firmware that an ATU is installed? When I press "ANT" on my
> ATU-less K3/100 I get the message "NO ATU". If both these concerns can be
> put away, count me in, too. I have always been bummed that I can't get two
> antennas without installing the ATU which I do not want to do. I consider an
> ATU to be part of the antenna system and should be installed as close to the
> antenna as possible (my KAT 500 is at the far end of a 100' coax run).
>
> AB2TC - Knut
>
> PS. If this is a double posting, I apologize. I *hate* hot keys.
>
>
>
> --
> View this message in context: http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/K3S-losing-swr-wattmeters-indications-on-tx-please-help-tp7618984p7618999.html
> Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
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Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

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Re: Trying to gauge interest

Gary Gregory-2
In reply to this post by Lewis Phelps
I have wondered often why Elecraft have not done so but maybe antenna swtches are common enough they didn't see a need?
Gar

-----Original Message-----
From: "Lewis Phelps" <[hidden email]>
Sent: ‎20/‎06/‎2016 3:00 AM
To: "Ken Arck" <[hidden email]>
Cc: "[hidden email]" <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Trying to gauge interest

Count me in!!!

Lew N6LEW

> On Jun 19, 2016, at 11:56 AM, Ken Arck <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> Hello fellow 10 watt K3 owners!
>
> As my main use for my K3s is 6 meter and 144 EME operation, I bought the 10 watt version without the antenna tuner. I dabble a little on HF but not a whole lot. As such, the 10 watt, no tuner version suits my needs, although I thought it would be nice to be able to select 2 different antennas from the front panel (one for HF and the other for 6 meters). Spending several hundred dollars for the KATU seemed a bit overkill to me just to get front panel selection of 2 antennas.
>
> So looking at the schematic, I saw how easy it would be to modify my KANT board to allow 2 antenna selection. I bread boarded up my schematic and It works exactly as I expected.
>
> So I'm debating having some pc boards made to replace the entire KANT board but only if there is enough interest to justify doing so and I wanted to see how y'all felt about it. I project the bare boards would run around $20 to $25. You would take the parts from your existing KANT and reuse them on this new board, in addition to adding around $12 worth of new parts. So for under $40, you could have dual antenna selection on your non-KATU equipped K3.
>
> Any interest?
>
> Ken
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> President and CTO - Arcom Communications
> Makers of repeater controllers and accessories.
> http://www.arcomcontrollers.com/
> Authorized Dealers for Kenwood and Telewave and
> we offer complete repeater packages!
> AH6LE/R - IRLP Node 3000
> http://www.irlp.net
> "We don't just make 'em. We use 'em!"
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>

Lew Phelps N6LEW
Pasadena, CA DM04wd
Elecraft K3-10 / KXV144 / XV432
Yaesu FT-7800
[hidden email]
www.n6lew.us

Generalized Law of Entropy: Sooner or later, everything that has been put together will fall apart.





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Re: K3S losing swr-wattmeters indications on tx - please help

Charles Johnson-2
In reply to this post by IK4EWX
I experienced this very problem when I upgraded my K3 to the new synthesizers. The problem would go away if I took out the new synthesizers and reinstalled the old ones. I contacted Wayne about this issue and finally narrowed it down to “key bounce”. I was using high quality keys such as Begali.

Apparently a software issue related to timings with the new synthesizers which has never been corrected.

73, Charles, K4ZRJ


> On Jun 19, 2016, at 4:16 AM, IK4EWX <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> I own a great K3S from a pair of months. It work great, dx, qsos, contest
> (just worked CQWPX, 1200 qsos).
> Just after bought it, sometime on cw transmission  the swr-rf indications,
> the moving black dots, gone all blanked, all on the swr and on RF
> indications.
> I thought about rfi problems, but it happened even with dummy load. And with
> no swr on antenna.
> With atu inserted is seemed more rarely happen.
> This morning I have this problem happen at least on 14-18-21-24-28mhz,
> keying the rig with my bug, only with long dash and not with dots string.
> It is a rainy cloudy day, but I think that doesnt matter :)
> When using the paddle with internal keyer I havent the problem.
> It seem to happen only when keying at least 2-3 seconds long.
> When it happen, with the two measurements blanked, the rig really continue
> to transmit - I see regular power on my external Bird 43 wattmeter.
> Somebody had this problem and know how to solve it?
> Many thanks
> Ian IK4EWX
>
>
>
> --
> View this message in context: http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/K3S-losing-swr-wattmeters-indications-on-tx-please-help-tp7618984.html
> Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to [hidden email]

______________________________________________________________
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Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

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