[ KX2] KXBT2 Charger

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[ KX2] KXBT2 Charger

Jerry Moore
KXBT2 Charger: Can the charger be connected to a DC power source without an
inverter to charge the KXBT2 Li-Ion battery pack? Considering the intended
POU is pedestrian I can see a great need/use for solar to power the
charger/recharge the battery pack. Depending upon circuit design it should
be doable.

KXBT2 Charger: Can the charger be used to power the KX2 Radio in the absence
of a battery pack? Might be a good feature to be able to concurrently
recharge the battery while also powering the radio. Remember the advertised
use is pedestrian style.

 

 

I'm very intrigued by the KX2 and have a specific use in mind..e.g. camping
with no access or availability of power mains. While using an inverter via
solar is an option the losses due to conversion efficiencies become too
great to be worthwhile in my view.

Thanks in advance.

 

Jerry Moore, AE4PB

K3S owner.

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Re: [ KX2] KXBT2 Charger

Peter Pauly
I feel kind of stupid buying a charger when I have a very expensive bench
power supply.  Does that battery pack have a balancing circuit and over
voltage protection?

On Thu, May 19, 2016 at 11:54 AM, Jerry Moore <[hidden email]>
wrote:

> KXBT2 Charger: Can the charger be connected to a DC power source without an
> inverter to charge the KXBT2 Li-Ion battery pack? Considering the intended
> POU is pedestrian I can see a great need/use for solar to power the
> charger/recharge the battery pack. Depending upon circuit design it should
> be doable.
>
> KXBT2 Charger: Can the charger be used to power the KX2 Radio in the
> absence
> of a battery pack? Might be a good feature to be able to concurrently
> recharge the battery while also powering the radio. Remember the advertised
> use is pedestrian style.
>
>
>
>
>
> I'm very intrigued by the KX2 and have a specific use in mind..e.g. camping
> with no access or availability of power mains. While using an inverter via
> solar is an option the losses due to conversion efficiencies become too
> great to be worthwhile in my view.
>
> Thanks in advance.
>
>
>
> Jerry Moore, AE4PB
>
> K3S owner.
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
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> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>
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Re: [ KX2] KXBT2 Charger

Ignacy
I charged my Li-ion batteries by a voltage regulator LM317 set to 12.6V. Never a problem and the battery lasted but the regulator needs a sink.

It would be really convenient to be able to charge (even slower) without removing the battery.

It would really be nice to add internal Li-Ion option to KX3. Would be one item less to attach.

Ignacy, NO9E

 
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Re: [ KX2] KXBT2 Charger

wayne burdick
Administrator
In reply to this post by Jerry Moore
There may be DC chargers that are compatible with the KX2's battery pack. We're looking at a few. Until then I highly recommend using our inexpensive fast charger, which is designed specifically for this application, with all required monitoring and control circuitry to ensure safe operation.

It is not possible to charge the KX2's batteries internally. See cautions in the documentation included with the battery and charger.

73,
Wayne
N6KR

On May 19, 2016, at 8:54 AM, "Jerry Moore" <[hidden email]> wrote:

> KXBT2 Charger: Can the charger be connected to a DC power source without an
> inverter to charge the KXBT2 Li-Ion battery pack? Considering the intended
> POU is pedestrian I can see a great need/use for solar to power the
> charger/recharge the battery pack. Depending upon circuit design it should
> be doable.
>
> KXBT2 Charger: Can the charger be used to power the KX2 Radio in the absence
> of a battery pack? Might be a good feature to be able to concurrently
> recharge the battery while also powering the radio. Remember the advertised
> use is pedestrian style.
>
>
>
>
>
> I'm very intrigued by the KX2 and have a specific use in mind..e.g. camping
> with no access or availability of power mains. While using an inverter via
> solar is an option the losses due to conversion efficiencies become too
> great to be worthwhile in my view.
>
> Thanks in advance.
>
>
>
> Jerry Moore, AE4PB
>
> K3S owner.
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to [hidden email]

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Re: [ KX2] KXBT2 Charger

MaverickNH
"Do not continue charging the battery if it does not recharge within the specified charging time. Doing so may cause the battery to become hot, rupture, or ignite."

Does this mean the battery should not be charged more than ~2hr to full charge? So it shouldn't be charged overnight?
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Re: [ KX2] KXBT2 Charger

Don Wilhelm
Yes, with Lithium batteries, follow the instructions.
If they do not recharge within the specified time, something is wrong.
Whether that specified charging time is 2 hours, or something else is of
no consequence.  If it does not charge within the specified time, it is
cause for investigation or replacement of the batteries.

If you wish to charge them overnight, I suggest you put them in a
non-flammable pan outdoors (away from buildings) and power the charger
with an extension cord.
That is for the safety of you and yours in case something bad happens.

There is a reason why shipping of lithium batteries is restricted - it
is all a matter of safety.

Lithium batteries are generally safe if treated properly, but must be
charged within the limits set by the manufacturer/distributor to
maintain that safety margin.  Follow the instructions of the battery
supplier, they have your safety in mind.

73,
Don W3FPR

On 7/29/2016 6:52 PM, MaverickNH wrote:
> "Do not continue charging the battery if it does not recharge within the
> specified charging time. Doing so may cause the battery to become hot,
> rupture, or ignite."
>
> Does this mean the battery should not be charged more than ~2hr to full
> charge? So it shouldn't be charged overnight?
>

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Re: [ KX2] KXBT2 Charger

w5sum
In reply to this post by Jerry Moore
Interesting question. In just received my kx2 today. I ordered everything EXEPT the kxbt2! I don't know how I missed that so I'm ordering it this weekend.
Can't wait to get on the air with it

Ronnie w5sum

MaverickNH <[hidden email]> wrote:

>"Do not continue charging the battery if it does not recharge within the
>specified charging time. Doing so may cause the battery to become hot,
>rupture, or ignite."
>
>Does this mean the battery should not be charged more than ~2hr to full
>charge? So it shouldn't be charged overnight?
>
>
>
>--
>View this message in context: http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/KX2-KXBT2-Charger-tp7617624p7620869.html
>Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
>______________________________________________________________
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Re: [ KX2] KXBT2 Charger

Bill Frantz
In reply to this post by Don Wilhelm
I would get a timer switch, set it for the recommended charging
time. and run the charger off that switch. If you get back
before it starts charging again, all should be well.

73 Bill AE6JV

On 7/29/16 at 5:02 PM, [hidden email] (Don Wilhelm) wrote:

>If you wish to charge them overnight, I suggest you put them in
>a non-flammable pan outdoors (away from buildings) and power
>the charger with an extension cord.
>That is for the safety of you and yours in case something bad happens.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Bill Frantz        | I don't have high-speed      | Periwinkle
(408)356-8506      | internet. I have DSL.        | 16345
Englewood Ave
www.pwpconsult.com |                              | Los Gatos,
CA 95032

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Re: [ KX2] KXBT2 Charger

Raymond Sills
Hi Bill:

One slick trick I’ve done with chargers is to use one of those timer switches… the type often used to turn on and off interior lighting, to make it appear that someone is home, when they are not home.   The model I have uses some plastic pins, color coded, to set the “on” time, (green) and the off time (red).   I just use the red pin, adjust the timer for the interval needed, based on the current time of day, and manually turn on the timer.  When it gets to the “off” time, it shuts off… never to turn on again, because there are no green pins in the timer wheel.  A great one-time-only power control.

73 de Ray
K2ULR
KX3 #211


> On Jul 29, 2016, at 10:22 PM, Bill Frantz <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> I would get a timer switch, set it for the recommended charging time. and run the charger off that switch. If you get back before it starts charging again, all should be well.
>
> 73 Bill AE6JV
>
> On 7/29/16 at 5:02 PM, [hidden email] (Don Wilhelm) wrote:
>
>> If you wish to charge them overnight, I suggest you put them in a non-flammable pan outdoors (away from buildings) and power the charger with an extension cord.
>> That is for the safety of you and yours in case something bad happens.
>
> -----------------------------------------------------------------------
> Bill Frantz        | I don't have high-speed      | Periwinkle
> (408)356-8506      | internet. I have DSL.        | 16345 Englewood Ave
> www.pwpconsult.com |                              | Los Gatos, CA 95032
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
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> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
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> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to [hidden email]

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Re: [ KX2] KXBT2 Charger

MaverickNH
I put a battery in a steel pan out on the concrete patio and charged overnight - the LED went Red to Green overnight and the battery was still cool in the morning, so all went well.

The timer sounds like a good solution for indoor safe charging, but I'll still do so in a pan on a patio block, just in case...  My son got a little battery-powered remote control race car many years ago, and the battery scorched the Formica counter top when it overheated during charging.  So yeah, those lithiums can be nasty without proper circuitry and care.

Bret/KC1CJN
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Re: [ KX2] KXBT2 Charger

John-6
All,

What specific chemistry are these batteries? Li-ion? LiPo? LiFePO4?

The three different types of lithium-based battery all have different ways
of 'looking after' them (I'm a heavy user of Lithium-based batteries, for
airsoft, portable radio and r/c...

I suspect the reason for the note about 'specified charging time' is based
on the chargers being designed to charge at a certain rate (usually measured
in 'C'... for 'capacity')... Presumably if it recommends a 2 hour charge,
the provided charger charges at 0.5C (half the capacity per hour).

If you stick the batteries on a 'proper' hobbyist's charger, you'll have a
variable maximum charging rate, so you could in theory cut it down and leave
it running longer... In fact some chemistries actually prefer to be charged
at anything as low as 0.1C!

If someone can fill in the blanks on battery types (and ideally the capacity
too!) that'd be fantastic.

As for the steel pan on the concrete patio... That's a great idea provided
it a) isn't going to rain and b) there aren't any bugs or creatures that
will nibble through your cabling. The conventional method of charging safely
indoors is to drop the batteries into a LiPo charging bag (available fairly
cheaply from all good r/c stores and hobbyist websites) which is designed to
contain any fire or explosion caused by improper overcharging of the
batteries. For what it's worth... LiPo and LiFePO4 batteries also need to be
balanced (and as such are sold with a 'balance connector' on a fly lead as
well as the main 'power output' connector. This allows all good chargers to
individually float a cell or pull a bit from another cell to keep all of
them in balance.

73, and a firm left handshake.
John (XLX)

-----Original Message-----
From: Elecraft [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of
MaverickNH
Sent: 30 July 2016 14:18
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] [ KX2] KXBT2 Charger

I put a battery in a steel pan out on the concrete patio and charged
overnight - the LED went Red to Green overnight and the battery was still
cool in the morning, so all went well.

The timer sounds like a good solution for indoor safe charging, but I'll
still do so in a pan on a patio block, just in case...  My son got a little
battery-powered remote control race car many years ago, and the battery
scorched the Formica counter top when it overheated during charging.  So
yeah, those lithiums can be nasty without proper circuitry and care.

Bret/KC1CJN



--
View this message in context:
http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/KX2-KXBT2-Charger-tp7617624p7620894.htm
l
Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
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Re: [ KX2] KXBT2 Charger

Bob N3MNT
One of the main failure modes of Li-Ion batteries is trying to charge a defective battery ( puffed pack).  When Li-Ion batteries begin to fail one or more cells develop a high internal resistance and heat up during charging.  The 2hr warning is likely driven by the danger of trying to charge a bad pack more than the a time limit  for a good pack.  For packs with built in management/balancing circuitry ( no access to individual cells) it is difficult to see a  bad cell.  If you are concerned, there are fireproof pouches to put the battery in during charging.  You can get them from most major RC model sites.
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Re: [ KX2] KXBT2 Charger

MaverickNH
In reply to this post by John-6
Good advice - I picked up a small LiPo Battery Bag from Amazon.