OT: Astron linear PS regulation issues

classic Classic list List threaded Threaded
13 messages Options
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

OT: Astron linear PS regulation issues

Rose
I've found instances of regulation failures caused
by loose hardware.  In particular the nuts atop the
filter caps that hold the regulator PC board loosen
and simply tightening then will cure the issue.  This
appears to be caused by compression of the PC board
material …"cold flow" to some readers.

There are several other common failures of this series
of PS's, but this one is perhaps the most prevalent.

While you have the cover off, check for paint under the
lug on the green power cord wire …

73!

Len Kopp- K0PP
______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: OT: Astron linear PS regulation issues

k6dgw
I've given up on Astron despite the fact that many people say they never
have troubles.  Apparently, Astron does not have a supplier for inside
star washers for screw/bolt connectors, I've found almost crumbly,
crystallized cold solder joints on the point-to-point wiring terminals
[in one case, it wasn't soldered at all], and often the case is not
bonded well [or at all] due to paint and/or no star washers.  These are
all basic steps in quality electronic construction, there's just no
excuse for it.

73,
Fred ["Skip"] K6DGW
Sparks NV DM09dn
Washoe County

On 2/25/2019 2:26 PM, Rose wrote:

> I've found instances of regulation failures caused
> by loose hardware.  In particular the nuts atop the
> filter caps that hold the regulator PC board loosen
> and simply tightening then will cure the issue.  This
> appears to be caused by compression of the PC board
> material …"cold flow" to some readers.
>
> There are several other common failures of this series
> of PS's, but this one is perhaps the most prevalent.
>
> While you have the cover off, check for paint under the
> lug on the green power cord wire …
>
> 73!
>
> Len Kopp- K0PP
>

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: OT: Astron linear PS regulation issues

Bill K9YEQ
How old is your PS?

73,
Bill
K9YEQ

https://wrj-tech.com/

-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email] <[hidden email]> On Behalf Of Fred Jensen
Sent: Monday, February 25, 2019 4:52 PM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] OT: Astron linear PS regulation issues

I've given up on Astron despite the fact that many people say they never have troubles.  Apparently, Astron does not have a supplier for inside star washers for screw/bolt connectors, I've found almost crumbly, crystallized cold solder joints on the point-to-point wiring terminals [in one case, it wasn't soldered at all], and often the case is not bonded well [or at all] due to paint and/or no star washers.  These are all basic steps in quality electronic construction, there's just no excuse for it.

73,
Fred ["Skip"] K6DGW
Sparks NV DM09dn
Washoe County

On 2/25/2019 2:26 PM, Rose wrote:

> I've found instances of regulation failures caused by loose hardware.  
> In particular the nuts atop the filter caps that hold the regulator PC
> board loosen and simply tightening then will cure the issue.  This
> appears to be caused by compression of the PC board material …"cold
> flow" to some readers.
>
> There are several other common failures of this series of PS's, but
> this one is perhaps the most prevalent.
>
> While you have the cover off, check for paint under the lug on the
> green power cord wire …
>
> 73!
>
> Len Kopp- K0PP
>

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: OT: Astron linear PS regulation issues

kt5te
In reply to this post by Rose
On Monday, February 25, 2019 4:26:40 PM CST Rose wrote:
> I've found instances of regulation failures caused
> by loose hardware.

With the RS-35m Astron Linear PS I have issues with noise.  I purchased the
PS because everyone around me swears that they are great.  Well, from my
experience the Powerwerx SS-30DV is far cleaner, quieter, and fewer $$.  I
though the problem was something along the line of LED lighting, in my
shack was generating the  noise.   When I used a battery for the PX3 & KX3
in my shack during a power outage the PX3 screen was so clear I was
stunned.    I have 3 different Astron linear PS and all are noisy.
--
73, Bill KT5TE
______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: OT: Astron linear PS regulation issues

K9MA
That's interesting. About the only way I know that a linear supply can
be noisy is if the regulator oscillates. That can easily happen. Most of
them use emitter followers, which are often unstable driving a
capacitive load. That's usually easy to fix by inserting a small
inductance between the emitter of the transistor and the load. A few
turns of the appropriate sized wire around a ferrite bead usually works.

73,
Scott K9MA

On 2/25/2019 18:57, William Rascher wrote:

> On Monday, February 25, 2019 4:26:40 PM CST Rose wrote:
>> I've found instances of regulation failures caused
>> by loose hardware.
> With the RS-35m Astron Linear PS I have issues with noise.  I purchased the
> PS because everyone around me swears that they are great.  Well, from my
> experience the Powerwerx SS-30DV is far cleaner, quieter, and fewer $$.  I
> though the problem was something along the line of LED lighting, in my
> shack was generating the  noise.   When I used a battery for the PX3 & KX3
> in my shack during a power outage the PX3 screen was so clear I was
> stunned.    I have 3 different Astron linear PS and all are noisy.


--
Scott  K9MA

[hidden email]

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: OT: Astron linear PS regulation issues

Bob McGraw - K4TAX
In reply to this post by Rose
I have personally found several instances in power supplies I either own
or have repaired where the green power wire lug is firmly attached by
the bolt and nut.   It however was nicely insulated by the paint!.    
Visual inspection is the best way to determine if an issue exists.  Do
take time to remove the bolt and nut securing  the wire lug to the
chassis.   Clean the area to bright shining metal where the lug would
come in contact with the chassis.  Then reattach the green wire and lug
with the original nut and bolt.

73

Bob, K4TAX


On 2/25/2019 4:26 PM, Rose wrote:
> While you have the cover off, check for paint under the
> lug on the green power cord wire …
>
> 73!
>
> Len Kopp- K0PP

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: OT: Astron linear PS regulation issues

hbjr
In reply to this post by K9MA
Filter caps bad?  AC on the DC supply side maybe?  A well made linear supply
does not make noise that has to be filtered otherwise.  All switching
supplies must be cleaned up because their design generates noise.

-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email] <[hidden email]> On
Behalf Of K9MA
Sent: Monday, February 25, 2019 8:13 PM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] OT: Astron linear PS regulation issues

That's interesting. About the only way I know that a linear supply can be
noisy is if the regulator oscillates. That can easily happen. Most of them
use emitter followers, which are often unstable driving a capacitive load.
That's usually easy to fix by inserting a small inductance between the
emitter of the transistor and the load. A few turns of the appropriate sized
wire around a ferrite bead usually works.

73,
Scott K9MA

On 2/25/2019 18:57, William Rascher wrote:
> On Monday, February 25, 2019 4:26:40 PM CST Rose wrote:
>> I've found instances of regulation failures caused by loose hardware.
> With the RS-35m Astron Linear PS I have issues with noise.  I
> purchased the PS because everyone around me swears that they are
> great.  Well, from my experience the Powerwerx SS-30DV is far cleaner,
> quieter, and fewer $$.  I though the problem was something along the line
of LED lighting, in my
> shack was generating the  noise.   When I used a battery for the PX3 & KX3
> in my shack during a power outage the PX3 screen was so clear I was
> stunned.    I have 3 different Astron linear PS and all are noisy.


--
Scott  K9MA

[hidden email]

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: OT: Astron linear PS regulation issues

Elecraft mailing list
I have 2 Astrons and they are great supplies. On both replaced the caps and all was very quiet
Ken WB8PKK

Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android
 
  On Mon, Feb 25, 2019 at 8:04 PM, [hidden email]<[hidden email]> wrote:   Filter caps bad?  AC on the DC supply side maybe?  A well made linear supply
does not make noise that has to be filtered otherwise.  All switching
supplies must be cleaned up because their design generates noise.

-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email] <[hidden email]> On
Behalf Of K9MA
Sent: Monday, February 25, 2019 8:13 PM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] OT: Astron linear PS regulation issues

That's interesting. About the only way I know that a linear supply can be
noisy is if the regulator oscillates. That can easily happen. Most of them
use emitter followers, which are often unstable driving a capacitive load.
That's usually easy to fix by inserting a small inductance between the
emitter of the transistor and the load. A few turns of the appropriate sized
wire around a ferrite bead usually works.

73,
Scott K9MA

On 2/25/2019 18:57, William Rascher wrote:
> On Monday, February 25, 2019 4:26:40 PM CST Rose wrote:
>> I've found instances of regulation failures caused by loose hardware.
> With the RS-35m Astron Linear PS I have issues with noise.  I
> purchased the PS because everyone around me swears that they are
> great.  Well, from my experience the Powerwerx SS-30DV is far cleaner,
> quieter, and fewer $$.  I though the problem was something along the line
of LED lighting, in my
> shack was generating the  noise.  When I used a battery for the PX3 & KX3
> in my shack during a power outage the PX3 screen was so clear I was
> stunned.    I have 3 different Astron linear PS and all are noisy.


--
Scott  K9MA

[hidden email]

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
 
______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: OT: Astron linear PS regulation issues

Victor Rosenthal 4X6GP
In reply to this post by k6dgw
I have had very good results with Astron, but I treat their products
like MFJ's: When I get a new one, I always open it up, check that
everything is tight, remove paint if needed, look at the soldering, etc.
It is worth checking the tightness of the connections to the capacitors
every 20 years or so.
The alternative to an Astron linear supply is usually a switcher, and I
try to avoid switchers when possible for reasons of electrical noise and
reliability.

73,
Victor, 4X6GP
Rehovot, Israel
Formerly K2VCO
CWops no. 5
http://www.qsl.net/k2vco/
On 26 Feb 2019 00:51, Fred Jensen wrote:

> I've given up on Astron despite the fact that many people say they never
> have troubles.  Apparently, Astron does not have a supplier for inside
> star washers for screw/bolt connectors, I've found almost crumbly,
> crystallized cold solder joints on the point-to-point wiring terminals
> [in one case, it wasn't soldered at all], and often the case is not
> bonded well [or at all] due to paint and/or no star washers.  These are
> all basic steps in quality electronic construction, there's just no
> excuse for it.
>
> 73,
> Fred ["Skip"] K6DGW
> Sparks NV DM09dn
> Washoe County
>
> On 2/25/2019 2:26 PM, Rose wrote:
>> I've found instances of regulation failures caused
>> by loose hardware.  In particular the nuts atop the
>> filter caps that hold the regulator PC board loosen
>> and simply tightening then will cure the issue.  This
>> appears to be caused by compression of the PC board
>> material …"cold flow" to some readers.
>>
>> There are several other common failures of this series
>> of PS's, but this one is perhaps the most prevalent.
>>
>> While you have the cover off, check for paint under the
>> lug on the green power cord wire …
>>
>> 73!
>>
>> Len Kopp- K0PP
>>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: OT: Astron linear PS regulation issues

Jim Brown-10
In reply to this post by Bob McGraw - K4TAX
YES!  This is a chronic problem with Astron supplies -- I've never seen
one that didn't have this problem!  I first discovered and documented
this issue almost 10 years ago.  In one supply, the two clam-shell
sections of the chassis were also insulated from each other by paint! 
This failure could easily cause instability!

http://k9yc.com/PowerSupplyBondingAndAudioDistortion.pdf

73, Jim K9YC

On 2/25/2019 6:24 PM, Bob McGraw K4TAX wrote:
> I have personally found several instances in power supplies I either
> own or have repaired where the green power wire lug is firmly attached
> by the bolt and nut.   It however was nicely insulated by the
> paint!.     Visual inspection is the best way to determine if an issue
> exists.  Do take time to remove the bolt and nut securing the wire lug
> to the chassis.   Clean the area to bright shining metal where the lug
> would come in contact with the chassis.  Then reattach the green wire
> and lug with the original nut and bolt.


______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: OT: Astron linear PS regulation issues

Ron Genovesi
Maybe they were bought out by MFJ   ;-)

     Ron Genovesi
           N3ETA
Sent from my iPhone

> On Feb 25, 2019, at 10:07 PM, Jim Brown <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> YES!  This is a chronic problem with Astron supplies -- I've never seen one that didn't have this problem!  I first discovered and documented this issue almost 10 years ago.  In one supply, the two clam-shell sections of the chassis were also insulated from each other by paint!  This failure could easily cause instability!
>
> http://k9yc.com/PowerSupplyBondingAndAudioDistortion.pdf
>
> 73, Jim K9YC
>
>> On 2/25/2019 6:24 PM, Bob McGraw K4TAX wrote:
>> I have personally found several instances in power supplies I either own or have repaired where the green power wire lug is firmly attached by the bolt and nut.   It however was nicely insulated by the paint!.     Visual inspection is the best way to determine if an issue exists.  Do take time to remove the bolt and nut securing the wire lug to the chassis.   Clean the area to bright shining metal where the lug would come in contact with the chassis.  Then reattach the green wire and lug with the original nut and bolt.
>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: OT: Astron linear PS regulation issues

k6dgw
Our use of the power supplies was on mountain top repeater and remote
base sites.  Access was generally time-consuming and sometimes
impossible at various times of the year.  The Astrons, while they could
be repaired and made to work ... at least for awhile ... were just too
unreliable and unpredictable for such service.  We ultimately lucked
into some Rockwell/Collins rack mounts that had been removed from
service and were at a government surplus auction.  The were rock solid.
We had to do a little modification to get the regulated voltage down
from 18 to 14 but that turned out to be two resistors. They'll probably
run until Antarctica melts.  Neither side of the outputs [there were
two] were connected to the frame.  Only downside was that it took two
strong guys to position them in the rack while a third installed the
screws. [:-)

If the PS is under or on your desk or table, the reliability issue would
be a lot less.

73,
Fred ["Skip"] K6DGW
Sparks NV DM09dn
Washoe County

On 2/26/2019 3:06 PM, Ron Genovesi wrote:
> Maybe they were bought out by MFJ   ;-)
>
>       Ron Genovesi
>             N3ETA
>

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: OT: Astron linear PS regulation issues

riese-k3djc
In reply to this post by Rose

thought this thread was over

Bob


On Tue, 26 Feb 2019 09:17:16 -0800 Ron Genovesi <[hidden email]>
writes:

> Astron used to make s great supply. I have the same problem with
> RS-35M less then a year old.
> Worked fine for 8 or 9 months then developed a bad hum or buzz. I
> got tired of listening to it and pulled out a 35 Amp switching
> supply. Haven�t had the time to pull it apart yet.
>
>      Ron Genovesi
>            N3ETA
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> > On Feb 26, 2019, at 8:12 AM, Ignacy <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >
> > I wanted to love a 45A Astron but it was heavy and hummed. Sold
> for peanuts
> > at a hamfest.
> >
> > Replaced by Jetstream JTPS32MAB. Probably same as MFJ-4230MV and
> many
> > others. Small, quiet and cheap. Excellent regulation. If it dies,
> it is $80.
> >
> > Ignacy, NO9E
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Sent from: http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/
> > ______________________________________________________________
> > Elecraft mailing list
> > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> > Post: mailto:[hidden email]
> >
> > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> > Please help support this email list:
> http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html