P3 center frequency

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P3 center frequency

N7US
Should the P3 center frequency and span be remembered when changing bands?
Rephrasing, can they be remembered when changing bands?

 

Jim N7US

 

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Re: P3 center frequency

k6dgw
Jim:  In general, yes, if you change bands with BAND ^/v.  When you
change bands via the CAT, the P3 center freq won't always end up where
you last had it.  I believe SPAN width is preserved but the span limits
show up strange.  It's a known issue, has been discussed at some length
here a few months ago.

73,
Fred ["Skip"] K6DGW
Sparks NV DM09dn
Washoe County

On 7/21/2019 10:31 AM, Jim N7US wrote:
> Should the P3 center frequency and span be remembered when changing bands?
> Rephrasing, can they be remembered when changing bands?
>
> Jim N7US
>

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Re: P3 center frequency

Randy Farmer
It's been brought up several times in the last two or three years. No
response from the P3 software guys. It's EXTREMELY annoying that the P3
won't respect the center frequency setting if the radio is tuned via any
CAT command. I've given up on hoping it will ever be fixed. My guess is
that it's all hands and the cooks working on K4 software these days.

73...
Randy, W8FN

On 7/21/2019 12:45 PM, Fred Jensen wrote:

> Jim: In general, yes, if you change bands with BAND ^/v.  When you
> change bands via the CAT, the P3 center freq won't always end up where
> you last had it.  I believe SPAN width is preserved but the span
> limits show up strange.  It's a known issue, has been discussed at
> some length here a few months ago.
>
> 73,
> Fred ["Skip"] K6DGW
> Sparks NV DM09dn
> Washoe County
>
> On 7/21/2019 10:31 AM, Jim N7US wrote:
>> Should the P3 center frequency and span be remembered when changing
>> bands?
>> Rephrasing, can they be remembered when changing bands?
>>
>> Jim N7US

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Re: P3 center frequency

Tom-4
In reply to this post by k6dgw
Hi,
What exactly do you mean?
It is always set to whatever you send.  If you explain this a little more perhaps I can help.
73



-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email] <[hidden email]> On Behalf Of Randy Farmer
Sent: July 21, 2019 2:44 PM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] P3 center frequency

It's been brought up several times in the last two or three years. No response from the P3 software guys. It's EXTREMELY annoying that the P3 won't respect the center frequency setting if the radio is tuned via any CAT command. I've given up on hoping it will ever be fixed. My guess is that it's all hands and the cooks working on K4 software these days.

73...
Randy, W8FN

On 7/21/2019 12:45 PM, Fred Jensen wrote:

> Jim: In general, yes, if you change bands with BAND ^/v.  When you
> change bands via the CAT, the P3 center freq won't always end up where
> you last had it.  I believe SPAN width is preserved but the span
> limits show up strange.  It's a known issue, has been discussed at
> some length here a few months ago.
>
> 73,
> Fred ["Skip"] K6DGW
> Sparks NV DM09dn
> Washoe County
>
> On 7/21/2019 10:31 AM, Jim N7US wrote:
>> Should the P3 center frequency and span be remembered when changing
>> bands?
>> Rephrasing, can they be remembered when changing bands?
>>
>> Jim N7US

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Re: P3 center frequency

k6dgw
Not sure who I'm talking to here, no signature, no call.  It's a little
hard to explain but ...

Assume you set SPAN=100 KHz and put the left edge at the bottom of each
band.  Changing bands back and forth using the BAND ^/v switch will
preserve these settings, and every time you come back to a previous
band, they will appear ... so long as you don't touch any of the P3
controls.  However, using CAT commands [e.g. from a logger], you can
change to a new band and the settings will hold, however returning to
the previous band, the SPAN will still be 100 KHz but the center
frequency will have moved and the left edge will no longer be at the
bottom of the band.  Admittedly, it's a bit hard to duplicate but the
circumstances that cause it are common in contesting and it has been
duplicated by several folk, including me.

The issue has been raised here on the list more than once.  I think it
first came up several years ago, which could be 1 or 6, even Apollo 11
seems like yesterday to me these days. [:-)  It has some of the earmarks
of an intentional attempt to "do something good" in the firmware which
turned out to be not so good, but I really don't know.  For whatever the
reason, I expect it to come back to the settings it had when I left that
band.

As Randy said, it is really annoying.  I, and I think most, use the P3
visually instead of looking at the K3.  If I set the left edge at the
bottom of the band and the SPAN at 100 KHz, I automatically visualize
the 1st 100 KHz directly from the screen. If it's changed as a result of
band changes, my mental picture of that band segment is wrong.

73,
Fred ["Skip"] K6DGW
Sparks NV DM09dn
Washoe County

On 7/21/2019 4:20 PM, Tom wrote:

> Hi,
> What exactly do you mean?
> It is always set to whatever you send.  If you explain this a little more perhaps I can help.
> 73
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [hidden email] <[hidden email]> On Behalf Of Randy Farmer
> Sent: July 21, 2019 2:44 PM
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] P3 center frequency
>
> It's been brought up several times in the last two or three years. No response from the P3 software guys. It's EXTREMELY annoying that the P3 won't respect the center frequency setting if the radio is tuned via any CAT command. I've given up on hoping it will ever be fixed. My guess is that it's all hands and the cooks working on K4 software these days.
>
> 73...
> Randy, W8FN
>
> On 7/21/2019 12:45 PM, Fred Jensen wrote:
>> Jim: In general, yes, if you change bands with BAND ^/v.  When you
>> change bands via the CAT, the P3 center freq won't always end up where
>> you last had it.  I believe SPAN width is preserved but the span
>> limits show up strange.  It's a known issue, has been discussed at
>> some length here a few months ago.
>>
>> 73,
>> Fred ["Skip"] K6DGW
>> Sparks NV DM09dn
>> Washoe County
>>
>> On 7/21/2019 10:31 AM, Jim N7US wrote:
>>> Should the P3 center frequency and span be remembered when changing
>>> bands?
>>> Rephrasing, can they be remembered when changing bands?
>>>
>>> Jim N7US
> ______________________________________________________________
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> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
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> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to [hidden email]
>
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Re: P3 center frequency

Victor Rosenthal 4X6GP
I have an additional problem, which is that sometimes this happens when
I use the band up and band down buttons on the rig. I have not been able
to understand why it only happens sometimes and not always.
I have a macro set up in the Commander module of the DXLabs program that
I use for logging, which checks what band I'm on and then resets the
limits and center as I want them, but it's still annoying.
Incidentally, for those who might be confused by the whole issue, it
applies to using the P3 in FIXED, not tracking, mode.

73,
Victor, 4X6GP
Rehovot, Israel
Formerly K2VCO
CWops no. 5
http://www.qsl.net/k2vco/
On 22/07/2019 3:04, Fred Jensen wrote:

> Not sure who I'm talking to here, no signature, no call.  It's a little
> hard to explain but ...
>
> Assume you set SPAN=100 KHz and put the left edge at the bottom of each
> band.  Changing bands back and forth using the BAND ^/v switch will
> preserve these settings, and every time you come back to a previous
> band, they will appear ... so long as you don't touch any of the P3
> controls.  However, using CAT commands [e.g. from a logger], you can
> change to a new band and the settings will hold, however returning to
> the previous band, the SPAN will still be 100 KHz but the center
> frequency will have moved and the left edge will no longer be at the
> bottom of the band.  Admittedly, it's a bit hard to duplicate but the
> circumstances that cause it are common in contesting and it has been
> duplicated by several folk, including me.
>
> The issue has been raised here on the list more than once.  I think it
> first came up several years ago, which could be 1 or 6, even Apollo 11
> seems like yesterday to me these days. [:-)  It has some of the earmarks
> of an intentional attempt to "do something good" in the firmware which
> turned out to be not so good, but I really don't know.  For whatever the
> reason, I expect it to come back to the settings it had when I left that
> band.
>
> As Randy said, it is really annoying.  I, and I think most, use the P3
> visually instead of looking at the K3.  If I set the left edge at the
> bottom of the band and the SPAN at 100 KHz, I automatically visualize
> the 1st 100 KHz directly from the screen. If it's changed as a result of
> band changes, my mental picture of that band segment is wrong.
>
> 73,
> Fred ["Skip"] K6DGW
> Sparks NV DM09dn
> Washoe County
>
> On 7/21/2019 4:20 PM, Tom wrote:
>> Hi,
>> What exactly do you mean?
>> It is always set to whatever you send.  If you explain this a little
>> more perhaps I can help.
>> 73
>>
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: [hidden email]
>> <[hidden email]> On Behalf Of Randy Farmer
>> Sent: July 21, 2019 2:44 PM
>> To: [hidden email]
>> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] P3 center frequency
>>
>> It's been brought up several times in the last two or three years. No
>> response from the P3 software guys. It's EXTREMELY annoying that the
>> P3 won't respect the center frequency setting if the radio is tuned
>> via any CAT command. I've given up on hoping it will ever be fixed. My
>> guess is that it's all hands and the cooks working on K4 software
>> these days.
>>
>> 73...
>> Randy, W8FN
>>
>> On 7/21/2019 12:45 PM, Fred Jensen wrote:
>>> Jim: In general, yes, if you change bands with BAND ^/v.  When you
>>> change bands via the CAT, the P3 center freq won't always end up where
>>> you last had it.  I believe SPAN width is preserved but the span
>>> limits show up strange.  It's a known issue, has been discussed at
>>> some length here a few months ago.
>>>
>>> 73,
>>> Fred ["Skip"] K6DGW
>>> Sparks NV DM09dn
>>> Washoe County
>>>
>>> On 7/21/2019 10:31 AM, Jim N7US wrote:
>>>> Should the P3 center frequency and span be remembered when changing
>>>> bands?
>>>> Rephrasing, can they be remembered when changing bands?
>>>>
>>>> Jim N7US
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html 
>> Message delivered to [hidden email]
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>>
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Re: P3 center frequency

Tom-4
In reply to this post by Tom-4
Hi,
Sorry, I forgot my signature.  It's Tom va2fsq.
I've tried this out quite a bit with Win4K3Suite, and in fixed mode changing bands always results in the correct behavior.  The left frequency in the P3 display is always where it was left the last time you were on that band.
Win4K3Suite issues the BN command when it switches bands.  It's possible that other packages where you see this behavior do not.
For example, N1MM, DXLab, actually sends the last frequency that was on the previous band.  It does not issue a BN command.  Other packages might do similar things.  
However, is this intermittent?  Or does it always occur.  Which application?  Is it possible that you QSY'd outside the span at some point?  The left frequency will then be different.
So unless this is intermittent, or caused by the application, it would seem that the P3 is operating correctly.
73 Tom
Va2fsq.com

-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email] <[hidden email]> On Behalf Of Fred Jensen
Sent: July 21, 2019 8:04 PM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] P3 center frequency

Not sure who I'm talking to here, no signature, no call.  It's a little hard to explain but ...

Assume you set SPAN=100 KHz and put the left edge at the bottom of each band.  Changing bands back and forth using the BAND ^/v switch will preserve these settings, and every time you come back to a previous band, they will appear ... so long as you don't touch any of the P3 controls.  However, using CAT commands [e.g. from a logger], you can change to a new band and the settings will hold, however returning to the previous band, the SPAN will still be 100 KHz but the center frequency will have moved and the left edge will no longer be at the bottom of the band.  Admittedly, it's a bit hard to duplicate but the circumstances that cause it are common in contesting and it has been duplicated by several folk, including me.

The issue has been raised here on the list more than once.  I think it first came up several years ago, which could be 1 or 6, even Apollo 11 seems like yesterday to me these days. [:-)  It has some of the earmarks of an intentional attempt to "do something good" in the firmware which turned out to be not so good, but I really don't know.  For whatever the reason, I expect it to come back to the settings it had when I left that band.

As Randy said, it is really annoying.  I, and I think most, use the P3 visually instead of looking at the K3.  If I set the left edge at the bottom of the band and the SPAN at 100 KHz, I automatically visualize the 1st 100 KHz directly from the screen. If it's changed as a result of band changes, my mental picture of that band segment is wrong.

73,
Fred ["Skip"] K6DGW
Sparks NV DM09dn
Washoe County

On 7/21/2019 4:20 PM, Tom wrote:

> Hi,
> What exactly do you mean?
> It is always set to whatever you send.  If you explain this a little more perhaps I can help.
> 73
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [hidden email] <[hidden email]> On Behalf Of Randy Farmer
> Sent: July 21, 2019 2:44 PM
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] P3 center frequency
>
> It's been brought up several times in the last two or three years. No response from the P3 software guys. It's EXTREMELY annoying that the P3 won't respect the center frequency setting if the radio is tuned via any CAT command. I've given up on hoping it will ever be fixed. My guess is that it's all hands and the cooks working on K4 software these days.
>
> 73...
> Randy, W8FN
>
> On 7/21/2019 12:45 PM, Fred Jensen wrote:
>> Jim: In general, yes, if you change bands with BAND ^/v.  When you
>> change bands via the CAT, the P3 center freq won't always end up where
>> you last had it.  I believe SPAN width is preserved but the span
>> limits show up strange.  It's a known issue, has been discussed at
>> some length here a few months ago.
>>
>> 73,
>> Fred ["Skip"] K6DGW
>> Sparks NV DM09dn
>> Washoe County
>>
>> On 7/21/2019 10:31 AM, Jim N7US wrote:
>>> Should the P3 center frequency and span be remembered when changing
>>> bands?
>>> Rephrasing, can they be remembered when changing bands?
>>>
>>> Jim N7US
> ______________________________________________________________
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Re: P3 center frequency

Alan Bloom
I'm out of town right now so I can't test this out.  But when it came up
before, as I recall the problem turned out to be as Tom says, some
software programs send frequency and band commands in an order that
causes the P3 to temporarily be tuned outside the span window.

Normally, the P3 tries to keep the VFO A frequency within the span, so
when the "wrong" frequency appears, the P3 re-tunes itself.  When the
frequency returns to the correct value, the P3 retunes again to put that
frequency somewheree within the span, using rules determined by the MENU
FixMode selection.

A think a workaround for this is to set FixMode to "Static".  As I say,
I am not able to test that right now since I'm out of town, but I think
that will force the frequency range to be corrrect even after a
software-initiated band change.

Alan N1AL

On 2019-07-22 08:23, Tom wrote:

> Hi,
> Sorry, I forgot my signature.  It's Tom va2fsq.
> I've tried this out quite a bit with Win4K3Suite, and in fixed mode changing bands always results in the correct behavior.  The left frequency in the P3 display is always where it was left the last time you were on that band.
> Win4K3Suite issues the BN command when it switches bands.  It's possible that other packages where you see this behavior do not.
> For example, N1MM, DXLab, actually sends the last frequency that was on the previous band.  It does not issue a BN command.  Other packages might do similar things.  
> However, is this intermittent?  Or does it always occur.  Which application?  Is it possible that you QSY'd outside the span at some point?  The left frequency will then be different.
> So unless this is intermittent, or caused by the application, it would seem that the P3 is operating correctly.
> 73 Tom
> Va2fsq.com
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [hidden email] <[hidden email]> On Behalf Of Fred Jensen
> Sent: July 21, 2019 8:04 PM
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] P3 center frequency
>
> Not sure who I'm talking to here, no signature, no call.  It's a little hard to explain but ...
>
> Assume you set SPAN=100 KHz and put the left edge at the bottom of each band.  Changing bands back and forth using the BAND ^/v switch will preserve these settings, and every time you come back to a previous band, they will appear ... so long as you don't touch any of the P3 controls.  However, using CAT commands [e.g. from a logger], you can change to a new band and the settings will hold, however returning to the previous band, the SPAN will still be 100 KHz but the center frequency will have moved and the left edge will no longer be at the bottom of the band.  Admittedly, it's a bit hard to duplicate but the circumstances that cause it are common in contesting and it has been duplicated by several folk, including me.
>
> The issue has been raised here on the list more than once.  I think it first came up several years ago, which could be 1 or 6, even Apollo 11 seems like yesterday to me these days. [:-)  It has some of the earmarks of an intentional attempt to "do something good" in the firmware which turned out to be not so good, but I really don't know.  For whatever the reason, I expect it to come back to the settings it had when I left that band.
>
> As Randy said, it is really annoying.  I, and I think most, use the P3 visually instead of looking at the K3.  If I set the left edge at the bottom of the band and the SPAN at 100 KHz, I automatically visualize the 1st 100 KHz directly from the screen. If it's changed as a result of band changes, my mental picture of that band segment is wrong.
>
> 73,
> Fred ["Skip"] K6DGW
> Sparks NV DM09dn
> Washoe County
>
> On 7/21/2019 4:20 PM, Tom wrote: Hi,
> What exactly do you mean?
> It is always set to whatever you send.  If you explain this a little more perhaps I can help.
> 73
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [hidden email] <[hidden email]> On Behalf Of Randy Farmer
> Sent: July 21, 2019 2:44 PM
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] P3 center frequency
>
> It's been brought up several times in the last two or three years. No response from the P3 software guys. It's EXTREMELY annoying that the P3 won't respect the center frequency setting if the radio is tuned via any CAT command. I've given up on hoping it will ever be fixed. My guess is that it's all hands and the cooks working on K4 software these days.
>
> 73...
> Randy, W8FN
>
> On 7/21/2019 12:45 PM, Fred Jensen wrote: Jim: In general, yes, if you change bands with BAND ^/v.  When you
> change bands via the CAT, the P3 center freq won't always end up where
> you last had it.  I believe SPAN width is preserved but the span
> limits show up strange.  It's a known issue, has been discussed at
> some length here a few months ago.
>
> 73,
> Fred ["Skip"] K6DGW
> Sparks NV DM09dn
> Washoe County
>
> On 7/21/2019 10:31 AM, Jim N7US wrote: Should the P3 center frequency and span be remembered when changing
> bands?
> Rephrasing, can they be remembered when changing bands?
>
> Jim N7US
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Re: P3 center frequency

k6dgw
Alan: Your description may be right on, it may explain why the effect is
difficult to reproduce and appears to be "intermittent," sometimes it
maintains the center frequency and sometimes it doesn't.  I'll try the
FixMode=Static with a controlled set of changes that I know will cause
the problem in Full Screen mode.

73,
Fred ["Skip"] K6DGW
Sparks NV DM09dn
Washoe County

On 7/22/2019 9:56 AM, Alan Bloom wrote:

>
> I'm out of town right now so I can't test this out.  But when it came
> up before, as I recall the problem turned out to be as Tom says, some
> software programs send frequency and band commands in an order that
> causes the P3 to temporarily be tuned outside the span window.
>
>
> Normally, the P3 tries to keep the VFO A frequency within the span, so
> when the "wrong" frequency appears, the P3 re-tunes itself.  When the
> frequency returns to the correct value, the P3 retunes again to put
> that frequency somewheree within the span, using rules determined by
> the MENU FixMode selection.
>
>
> A think a workaround for this is to set FixMode to "Static". As I say,
> I am not able to test that right now since I'm out of town, but I
> think that will force the frequency range to be corrrect even after a
> software-initiated band change.
>
>
>

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