Skimmer and the K3S

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Skimmer and the K3S

Peter W2IRT
Hello all,
With the vast majority of my friends having gone the Flex route rather than
the K3, I'm finding I'm at a rather huge disadvantage in terms of CW
operation, and that's Skimmer, which is an absolute game-changer for
everybody who's running it. I just can't figure out how to make it work
acceptably well with the K3S/P3 combination I have here.

I went the LP-PAN route and the birdies/mirror images make that device
wholly unsuitable for me, so I'm back to square one. I don't want to spend
another small fortune on interface boxes, but something better than LP-PAN
is clearly the answer. I just don't know what it is, what to do once I buy
it, or anything else. The big limitation I have is whatever devices that I
will need to buy will also have to play well with MicroHam Router software,
and in the past that has left my head spinning. This stuff is SO far beyond
my understanding I feel as if I've been thrown into the deep end of the pool
without knowing how to swim.

Working backwards, let's say the required end result is to have the CW
portion of whichever band I'm on skimmed and calls displayed on my bandmap
in either N1MM+ or DX Labs' Commander. Not 22kHz worth of calls relative to
my operating frequency, but everything, from .000 to .100 and maybe beyond.
If I'm running in CQWW or ARRL-CW, I'm less impressed with what the cluster
is showing me and would rather rely more heavily on what my own antenna is
picking up.

I have only two antenna feeds on the property: Whatever's selected on the
tower or a K9AY loop connected to the RX-in line on the back of the K3S. I
don't' have a separate antenna to feed another receiver so I guess the idea
is to take signal off the IF from the P3 out, yes? Like I said, I'm really
very old-school and I need help getting up to speed with all this stuff. I
migrated from a Mark V last year and the learning curve on the K3S is still
as steep as Mt. Everest for me. Any help greatly appreciated,
please'n'thanks!

---------------------------------------------
73 and Good DX
Peter, W2IRT

 

S/N 10023

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Re: Skimmer and the K3S

Don Wilhelm
Pete,

I think you are mixing too many things together, and they are not
necessarily related.
Let me try to 'unravel the ball of twine' for you.

The birdies/mirror images you encountered are not the fault of LP-Pan,
but instead related to either your soundcard cables or the capability of
the Panadapter display software that you were using.

Since you now have the P3 and are apparently happy with it for the
Panadapter display,  I suggest you continue to use it.

BUT,  you cannot display Skimmer on the P3.

So 'what to do'? - I would suggest that you use the LP-Pan hardware.  
Connect the K3 IF output to both the P and the LP-Pan (use a BNC T adapter).

Connect the LP-Pan I/Q outputs to your computer soundcard and load
Skimmer on your computer.    Configure CW Skimmer to use that soundcard
and it will display whatever is within it's "hearing range".  The
document at http://www.dxatlas.com/CwSkimmer/Files/Skimmerintro.pdf may
be helpful with your setup.
Note carefully, you do not have to run NaP3 or other panadapter
applications - CW Skimmer is independent of those.

If you need to run other PC applications (loggers and other rig control
applications) that each want to use the COM port connection to your K3
(in addition to CW Skimmer) - only one application can talk with the K3
at the same time.  Enter LP-Bridge or Com-O-Com which create virtual
ports on your PC.  IMHO LP-Bridge is a good choice for use with the K3,
but all your applications that want to talk with the K3 will talk
instead to their own LP-Bridge virtual ports - only LP-Bridge connects
directly to the K3.

Hopefully that helps.

73,
Don W3FPR

On 9/2/2016 2:01 PM, Peter W2IRT wrote:

> Hello all,
> With the vast majority of my friends having gone the Flex route rather than
> the K3, I'm finding I'm at a rather huge disadvantage in terms of CW
> operation, and that's Skimmer, which is an absolute game-changer for
> everybody who's running it. I just can't figure out how to make it work
> acceptably well with the K3S/P3 combination I have here.
>
> I went the LP-PAN route and the birdies/mirror images make that device
> wholly unsuitable for me, so I'm back to square one. I don't want to spend
> another small fortune on interface boxes, but something better than LP-PAN
> is clearly the answer. I just don't know what it is, what to do once I buy
> it, or anything else.

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Re: Skimmer and the K3S

Wes Stewart-2
My eyes glaze over at the thought of Skimmer, but I heartily agree with Don
about LP-Bridge.  I use it with my K3s and run my logging program (DXBase),
SpectraVue (runs SDR-IQ as bandscope), MMTTY, FLDIGI, N1MM, etc.  LP-Bridge will
also start all of these programs automatically when executed.

On 9/2/2016 4:09 PM, Don Wilhelm wrote:

> Pete,
> ...
>
> If you need to run other PC applications (loggers and other rig control
> applications) that each want to use the COM port connection to your K3 (in
> addition to CW Skimmer) - only one application can talk with the K3 at the
> same time.  Enter LP-Bridge or Com-O-Com which create virtual ports on your
> PC. IMHO LP-Bridge is a good choice for use with the K3, but all your
> applications that want to talk with the K3 will talk instead to their own
> LP-Bridge virtual ports - only LP-Bridge connects directly to the K3.
>
> Hopefully that helps.
>
> 73,
> Don W3FPR

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Re: Skimmer and the K3S

Wes Stewart-2
In reply to this post by Peter W2IRT
Why?  And I'm not being factious, I really would like to know the reasons.

  On 9/2/2016 11:01 AM, Peter W2IRT wrote:
> Hello all,
> With the vast majority of my friends having gone the Flex route rather than
> the K3,

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Re: Skimmer and the K3S

Alan Bloom
In reply to this post by Don Wilhelm
Excellent explanation Don.  Just one thing:

 > Connect the K3 IF output to both the P and the LP-Pan (use a BNC T
 > adapter).

No adapter is required.  The P3 has an internal 3 dB splitter and an IF
OUT connector that can be connected to LP-PAN.  Just make sure the
rear-panel switch is in the "ON" (up) position.

Alan N1AL




On 09/02/2016 04:09 PM, Don Wilhelm wrote:

> Pete,
>
> I think you are mixing too many things together, and they are not
> necessarily related.
> Let me try to 'unravel the ball of twine' for you.
>
> The birdies/mirror images you encountered are not the fault of LP-Pan,
> but instead related to either your soundcard cables or the capability of
> the Panadapter display software that you were using.
>
> Since you now have the P3 and are apparently happy with it for the
> Panadapter display,  I suggest you continue to use it.
>
> BUT,  you cannot display Skimmer on the P3.
>
> So 'what to do'? - I would suggest that you use the LP-Pan hardware.
> Connect the K3 IF output to both the P and the LP-Pan (use a BNC T
> adapter).
>
> Connect the LP-Pan I/Q outputs to your computer soundcard and load
> Skimmer on your computer.    Configure CW Skimmer to use that soundcard
> and it will display whatever is within it's "hearing range".  The
> document at http://www.dxatlas.com/CwSkimmer/Files/Skimmerintro.pdf may
> be helpful with your setup.
> Note carefully, you do not have to run NaP3 or other panadapter
> applications - CW Skimmer is independent of those.
>
> If you need to run other PC applications (loggers and other rig control
> applications) that each want to use the COM port connection to your K3
> (in addition to CW Skimmer) - only one application can talk with the K3
> at the same time.  Enter LP-Bridge or Com-O-Com which create virtual
> ports on your PC.  IMHO LP-Bridge is a good choice for use with the K3,
> but all your applications that want to talk with the K3 will talk
> instead to their own LP-Bridge virtual ports - only LP-Bridge connects
> directly to the K3.
>
> Hopefully that helps.
>
> 73,
> Don W3FPR
>
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Re: Skimmer and the K3S

Joe Subich, W4TV-4
In reply to this post by Peter W2IRT

If you expect 100 KHz (more than 22 KHz) with CW Skimmer you will need
to split the receive antenna loop and feed a true SDR (e.g., SDR I/Q,
Perseus, QSR1, etc or equivalent) tuned to the bottom of the active
band.  See the CW skimmer documentation - any configuration that feeds
skimmer from the IF and tracks the IF offset is limited to 22 KHz (the
operating frequency +/- 11 KHz).

This is a design choice made by the developer of CW Skimmer.  If you
have questions, contact him.

The "direct" receiver configuration does not require/use microHAM
Router.  Other software is used to link logging software and skimmer.

73,

    ... Joe, W4TV


On 9/2/2016 2:01 PM, Peter W2IRT wrote:

> Hello all,
> With the vast majority of my friends having gone the Flex route rather than
> the K3, I'm finding I'm at a rather huge disadvantage in terms of CW
> operation, and that's Skimmer, which is an absolute game-changer for
> everybody who's running it. I just can't figure out how to make it work
> acceptably well with the K3S/P3 combination I have here.
>
> I went the LP-PAN route and the birdies/mirror images make that device
> wholly unsuitable for me, so I'm back to square one. I don't want to spend
> another small fortune on interface boxes, but something better than LP-PAN
> is clearly the answer. I just don't know what it is, what to do once I buy
> it, or anything else. The big limitation I have is whatever devices that I
> will need to buy will also have to play well with MicroHam Router software,
> and in the past that has left my head spinning. This stuff is SO far beyond
> my understanding I feel as if I've been thrown into the deep end of the pool
> without knowing how to swim.
>
> Working backwards, let's say the required end result is to have the CW
> portion of whichever band I'm on skimmed and calls displayed on my bandmap
> in either N1MM+ or DX Labs' Commander. Not 22kHz worth of calls relative to
> my operating frequency, but everything, from .000 to .100 and maybe beyond.
> If I'm running in CQWW or ARRL-CW, I'm less impressed with what the cluster
> is showing me and would rather rely more heavily on what my own antenna is
> picking up.
>
> I have only two antenna feeds on the property: Whatever's selected on the
> tower or a K9AY loop connected to the RX-in line on the back of the K3S. I
> don't' have a separate antenna to feed another receiver so I guess the idea
> is to take signal off the IF from the P3 out, yes? Like I said, I'm really
> very old-school and I need help getting up to speed with all this stuff. I
> migrated from a Mark V last year and the learning curve on the K3S is still
> as steep as Mt. Everest for me. Any help greatly appreciated,
> please'n'thanks!
>
> ---------------------------------------------
> 73 and Good DX
> Peter, W2IRT
>
>
>
> S/N 10023
>
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Re: Skimmer and the K3S

Don Wilhelm
In reply to this post by Alan Bloom
Thanks Alan,

Yes, by all means ignore my suggestion about using the T adapter and
connect LP-Pan to the IF OUT on the P3.

Sorry for my mental lapse - I should have been thinking better,
especially since I set up 2 P3s for the Shelby, NC hamfest this
afternoon, and knew perfectly well that the P3 has an IF out. That is a
replication of the IF IN.

73,
Don W3FPR

On 9/2/2016 7:38 PM, Alan Bloom wrote:

> Excellent explanation Don.  Just one thing:
>
> > Connect the K3 IF output to both the P and the LP-Pan (use a BNC T
> > adapter).
>
> No adapter is required.  The P3 has an internal 3 dB splitter and an
> IF OUT connector that can be connected to LP-PAN.  Just make sure the
> rear-panel switch is in the "ON" (up) position.
>
> Alan N1AL
>
>
>
>
> On 09/02/2016 04:09 PM, Don Wilhelm wrote:
>> Pete,
>>
>> I think you are mixing too many things together, and they are not
>> necessarily related.
>> Let me try to 'unravel the ball of twine' for you.
>>
>> The birdies/mirror images you encountered are not the fault of LP-Pan,
>> but instead related to either your soundcard cables or the capability of
>> the Panadapter display software that you were using.
>>
>> Since you now have the P3 and are apparently happy with it for the
>> Panadapter display,  I suggest you continue to use it.
>>
>> BUT,  you cannot display Skimmer on the P3.
>>
>> So 'what to do'? - I would suggest that you use the LP-Pan hardware.
>> Connect the K3 IF output to both the P and the LP-Pan (use a BNC T
>> adapter).
>>
>> Connect the LP-Pan I/Q outputs to your computer soundcard and load
>> Skimmer on your computer.    Configure CW Skimmer to use that soundcard
>> and it will display whatever is within it's "hearing range". The
>> document at http://www.dxatlas.com/CwSkimmer/Files/Skimmerintro.pdf may
>> be helpful with your setup.
>> Note carefully, you do not have to run NaP3 or other panadapter
>> applications - CW Skimmer is independent of those.
>>
>> If you need to run other PC applications (loggers and other rig control
>> applications) that each want to use the COM port connection to your K3
>> (in addition to CW Skimmer) - only one application can talk with the K3
>> at the same time.  Enter LP-Bridge or Com-O-Com which create virtual
>> ports on your PC.  IMHO LP-Bridge is a good choice for use with the K3,
>> but all your applications that want to talk with the K3 will talk
>> instead to their own LP-Bridge virtual ports - only LP-Bridge connects
>> directly to the K3.
>>
>> Hopefully that helps.
>>

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Re: Skimmer and the K3S

Peter W2IRT
In reply to this post by Don Wilhelm
-----Original Message-----
From: Don Wilhelm [mailto:[hidden email]]
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Skimmer and the K3S

Pete,

I think you are mixing too many things together, and they are not
necessarily related.
Let me try to 'unravel the ball of twine' for you.

The birdies/mirror images you encountered are not the fault of LP-Pan, but
instead related to either your soundcard cables or the capability of the
Panadapter display software that you were using.

[pjd] I have tried four different sound cards on a very powerful PC (i7/32GB
RAM/SSD that has tons of processor, drive and RAM headroom, with virtually
nothing running), the birdies are identical with all the different sound
cards. I stuck with the Xonar U5. I've been over the level settings a
hundred times and that's not the issue. I believe I read somewhere that an
xtal oscillator inside the LP is the cause. There is nothing I can do to fix
it.


 >>Since you now have the P3 and are apparently happy with it for the
Panadapter display,  I suggest you continue to use it.
 >>BUT,  you cannot display Skimmer on the P3.
[pjd] I never did. I use the IF OUT from the K3S backplane to the IF IN on
the P3, then use the IF OUT from the P3 (setting the switch on the back to
open that port up) to feed into the LP-PAN.

[pjd] >>Connect the K3 IF output to both the P and the LP-Pan (use a BNC T
adapter).
[pjd] See above.

Connect the LP-Pan I/Q outputs to your computer soundcard and load
Skimmer on your computer.    Configure CW Skimmer to use that soundcard
and it will display whatever is within it's "hearing range".  The document
at http://www.dxatlas.com/CwSkimmer/Files/Skimmerintro.pdf may be helpful
with your setup.

[pjd] Yes, this was all done when I bought the LP-PAN and Skimmer. It IS
working as best it can, but it cannot do what I need it to do, and that's
why I'm posting here--unless I've completely misunderstood the LP-PAN
limitations. That device seems to only allow me to see something like 22 kHz
on either side of my tuned frequency. If I'm working at 14.022, that's
great. I can see 14.000 to 12.044. If I'm S&Ping at 14.095 I'm kinda hosed.

I reiterate, I need to be able to see then entire CW sub-band (or as much as
possible), from 14.000 to 14.100 at least. I'd be good with a 96 kHz spread
(14.0-14.096), INDEPENDENT of where my 2nd VFO is tuned. I do not believe
LP-PAN can achieve this desired goal, but again, I could be mistaken.

 >>Note carefully, you do not have to run NaP3 or other panadapter
applications - CW Skimmer is independent of those.
[pjd] That's good, because I don't' want to run any of those. I just want
the decoded calls to show up on my bandmap.

If you need to run other PC applications (loggers and other rig control
applications) that each want to use the COM port connection to your K3 (in
addition to CW Skimmer) - only one application can talk with the K3 at the
same time.  Enter LP-Bridge or Com-O-Com which create virtual ports on your
PC.  IMHO LP-Bridge is a good choice for use with the K3, but all your
applications that want to talk with the K3 will talk instead to their own
LP-Bridge virtual ports - only LP-Bridge connects directly to the K3.

[pjd] LP- Bridge will not work on my system, period. I've tried for months
to make it play and it just won't. It's also probably not necessary for what
I want to do. I get failure after failure, and I'm 99% sure it's conflicting
with MicroHam Router (software I desperately wish I could dispense with
forever, but I can't achieve half the functionality of my station without a
MicroKeyer-II).


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73, Peter W2IRT
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Re: Skimmer and the K3S

Don Wilhelm
Pete,

You need to blame the right element.  It is not LP-Pan, but a limitation
of Skimmer.
It limits the span to 22kHz when operating from an IF derived system.

73,
Don W3FPR

On 9/2/2016 9:28 PM, Peter W2IRT wrote:

> [pjd] Yes, this was all done when I bought the LP-PAN and Skimmer. It IS
> working as best it can, but it cannot do what I need it to do, and that's
> why I'm posting here--unless I've completely misunderstood the LP-PAN
> limitations. That device seems to only allow me to see something like 22 kHz
> on either side of my tuned frequency. If I'm working at 14.022, that's
> great. I can see 14.000 to 12.044. If I'm S&Ping at 14.095 I'm kinda hosed.
>
> I reiterate, I need to be able to see then entire CW sub-band (or as much as
> possible), from 14.000 to 14.100 at least. I'd be good with a 96 kHz spread
> (14.0-14.096), INDEPENDENT of where my 2nd VFO is tuned. I do not believe
> LP-PAN can achieve this desired goal, but again, I could be mistaken.
>
>

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Re: Skimmer and the K3S

kstover
In reply to this post by Peter W2IRT
Bill,

As has been said by others in this thread...any bandwidth limitations
you get while running Skimmer are because that's the way the developer
of Skimmer wanted it or was required to have it. LP-Pan display
bandwidth is dictated by nothing other than the bandwidth of you sound
card and the software you run to view it. If you're seeing images on the
spectrum, again, that's a software thing. I'm sure all the SDR software
out there have procedures to null those out.  It would be the same if
you went the more expensive SDR's They are all single conversion
receivers and will generate images.

If you were so inclines you could buy a KX3 and use it. Same basic
architecture as the high prices SDR's like QS1R and Perseus, RX I/Q
output straight to the computer. Skimmer would still be limited to + or
- 22KHz and there would still be images that needed nulling via the SDR
software.

You have a Zonar 5, good card, 192KHz bandwidth. Using it's big brother
the U7 (same specs) I get right around 95KHz either side of my VFO
frequency on the spectrum display. I can plant my VFO on 14.060 and see
the entire CW segment with out touching a thing. I choose not to limit
myself by using Skimmer. Crank the displayed bandwidth down to + or -
5KHz on a DX pileup and it's magical. I can see where the last caller
was/is in the pileup and can see which way the DX is working the pile,
up or down, and put my signal in the right spot for a call. It's like
shooting fish in a barrel.

As for the conflict between LP-Bridge and Router, it's to be expected.
Two applications which do more or less the same thing fighting over
control of serial ports. I doubt seriously having both installed on the
computer at the same time causes any conflict for either. Using them at
the same time most assuredly will.


> [pjd] Yes, this was all done when I bought the LP-PAN and Skimmer. It IS
> working as best it can, but it cannot do what I need it to do, and that's
> why I'm posting here--unless I've completely misunderstood the LP-PAN
> limitations. That device seems to only allow me to see something like 22 kHz
> on either side of my tuned frequency. If I'm working at 14.022, that's
> great. I can see 14.000 to 12.044. If I'm S&Ping at 14.095 I'm kinda hosed.
>
> I reiterate, I need to be able to see then entire CW sub-band (or as much as
> possible), from 14.000 to 14.100 at least. I'd be good with a 96 kHz spread
> (14.0-14.096), INDEPENDENT of where my 2nd VFO is tuned. I do not believe
> LP-PAN can achieve this desired goal, but again, I could be mistaken.
>
>   >>Note carefully, you do not have to run NaP3 or other panadapter
> applications - CW Skimmer is independent of those.
> [pjd] That's good, because I don't' want to run any of those. I just want
> the decoded calls to show up on my bandmap.
>
>

--
R. Kevin Stover
AC0H
ARRL
FISTS #11993
SKCC #215
NAQCC #3441


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Re: Skimmer and the K3S

kstover
Should read... Having them on most assuredly will.


On 9/3/2016 9:39 AM, Kevin wrote:

> Bill,
>
> As has been said by others in this thread...any bandwidth limitations
> you get while running Skimmer are because that's the way the developer
> of Skimmer wanted it or was required to have it. LP-Pan display
> bandwidth is dictated by nothing other than the bandwidth of you sound
> card and the software you run to view it. If you're seeing images on
> the spectrum, again, that's a software thing. I'm sure all the SDR
> software out there have procedures to null those out.  It would be the
> same if you went the more expensive SDR's They are all single
> conversion receivers and will generate images.
>
> If you were so inclines you could buy a KX3 and use it. Same basic
> architecture as the high prices SDR's like QS1R and Perseus, RX I/Q
> output straight to the computer. Skimmer would still be limited to +
> or - 22KHz and there would still be images that needed nulling via the
> SDR software.
>
> You have a Zonar 5, good card, 192KHz bandwidth. Using it's big
> brother the U7 (same specs) I get right around 95KHz either side of my
> VFO frequency on the spectrum display. I can plant my VFO on 14.060
> and see the entire CW segment with out touching a thing. I choose not
> to limit myself by using Skimmer. Crank the displayed bandwidth down
> to + or - 5KHz on a DX pileup and it's magical. I can see where the
> last caller was/is in the pileup and can see which way the DX is
> working the pile, up or down, and put my signal in the right spot for
> a call. It's like shooting fish in a barrel.
>
> As for the conflict between LP-Bridge and Router, it's to be expected.
> Two applications which do more or less the same thing fighting over
> control of serial ports. I doubt seriously having both installed on
> the computer at the same time causes any conflict for either. Using
> them at the same time most assuredly will.
>
>
>> [pjd] Yes, this was all done when I bought the LP-PAN and Skimmer. It IS
>> working as best it can, but it cannot do what I need it to do, and
>> that's
>> why I'm posting here--unless I've completely misunderstood the LP-PAN
>> limitations. That device seems to only allow me to see something like
>> 22 kHz
>> on either side of my tuned frequency. If I'm working at 14.022, that's
>> great. I can see 14.000 to 12.044. If I'm S&Ping at 14.095 I'm kinda
>> hosed.
>>
>> I reiterate, I need to be able to see then entire CW sub-band (or as
>> much as
>> possible), from 14.000 to 14.100 at least. I'd be good with a 96 kHz
>> spread
>> (14.0-14.096), INDEPENDENT of where my 2nd VFO is tuned. I do not
>> believe
>> LP-PAN can achieve this desired goal, but again, I could be mistaken.
>>
>>   >>Note carefully, you do not have to run NaP3 or other panadapter
>> applications - CW Skimmer is independent of those.
>> [pjd] That's good, because I don't' want to run any of those. I just
>> want
>> the decoded calls to show up on my bandmap.
>>
>>
>

--
R. Kevin Stover
AC0H
ARRL
FISTS #11993
SKCC #215
NAQCC #3441


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Re: Skimmer and the K3S

Pete Smith N4ZR
In reply to this post by Joe Subich, W4TV-4
I assume the K3S also has the RX IN/OUT jacks of the K3.  In that case
you can put a splitter in the line from RX out, and feed one leg back
through RX IN.  Then, any time you select the RX antenna from the front
panel you will send all signals from the antenna both to the K23S and to
a separate SDR, albeit with about a 3.5 dB loss in each signal.

To achieve what you want, I suggest looking at the WaterfallBandmap by
Steve London, N2IC.  It is a free app that can be downloaded from
<http://www.kkn.net/~n2ic/WB_071316.zip>.  I won't try to replicate the
very good documentation in the zipfile, but I believe it accomplishes
everything you would want in terms of integration among CW Skimmer, your
radio, and N1MM+. It incorporates a separate clickable waterfall/bandmap
that tracks with your radio.

Anyhow, have a look.  Steve heartily recommends the $149 SDRPlay SDR
<www.sdrplay.com>, which eliminates need for a sound card to be in the
loop as well as a lot of the problems with images that involving as
sound card brings into the mix..

73, Pete N4ZR
Download the new N1MM Logger+ at
<http://N1MM.hamdocs.com>. Check
out the Reverse Beacon Network at
<http://reversebeacon.net>, now
spotting RTTY activity worldwide.
For spots, please use your favorite
"retail" DX cluster.

On 9/2/2016 8:19 PM, Joe Subich, W4TV wrote:

>
> If you expect 100 KHz (more than 22 KHz) with CW Skimmer you will need
> to split the receive antenna loop and feed a true SDR (e.g., SDR I/Q,
> Perseus, QSR1, etc or equivalent) tuned to the bottom of the active
> band.  See the CW skimmer documentation - any configuration that feeds
> skimmer from the IF and tracks the IF offset is limited to 22 KHz (the
> operating frequency +/- 11 KHz).
>
> This is a design choice made by the developer of CW Skimmer.  If you
> have questions, contact him.
>
> The "direct" receiver configuration does not require/use microHAM
> Router.  Other software is used to link logging software and skimmer.
>
> 73,
>
>    ... Joe, W4TV
>
>
> On 9/2/2016 2:01 PM, Peter W2IRT wrote:
>> Hello all,
>> With the vast majority of my friends having gone the Flex route
>> rather than
>> the K3, I'm finding I'm at a rather huge disadvantage in terms of CW
>> operation, and that's Skimmer, which is an absolute game-changer for
>> everybody who's running it. I just can't figure out how to make it work
>> acceptably well with the K3S/P3 combination I have here.
>>
>> I went the LP-PAN route and the birdies/mirror images make that device
>> wholly unsuitable for me, so I'm back to square one. I don't want to
>> spend
>> another small fortune on interface boxes, but something better than
>> LP-PAN
>> is clearly the answer. I just don't know what it is, what to do once
>> I buy
>> it, or anything else. The big limitation I have is whatever devices
>> that I
>> will need to buy will also have to play well with MicroHam Router
>> software,
>> and in the past that has left my head spinning. This stuff is SO far
>> beyond
>> my understanding I feel as if I've been thrown into the deep end of
>> the pool
>> without knowing how to swim.
>>
>> Working backwards, let's say the required end result is to have the CW
>> portion of whichever band I'm on skimmed and calls displayed on my
>> bandmap
>> in either N1MM+ or DX Labs' Commander. Not 22kHz worth of calls
>> relative to
>> my operating frequency, but everything, from .000 to .100 and maybe
>> beyond.
>> If I'm running in CQWW or ARRL-CW, I'm less impressed with what the
>> cluster
>> is showing me and would rather rely more heavily on what my own
>> antenna is
>> picking up.
>>
>> I have only two antenna feeds on the property: Whatever's selected on
>> the
>> tower or a K9AY loop connected to the RX-in line on the back of the
>> K3S. I
>> don't' have a separate antenna to feed another receiver so I guess
>> the idea
>> is to take signal off the IF from the P3 out, yes? Like I said, I'm
>> really
>> very old-school and I need help getting up to speed with all this
>> stuff. I
>> migrated from a Mark V last year and the learning curve on the K3S is
>> still
>> as steep as Mt. Everest for me. Any help greatly appreciated,
>> please'n'thanks!
>>
>> ---------------------------------------------
>> 73 and Good DX
>> Peter, W2IRT
>>
>>
>>
>> S/N 10023
>>
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Re: Skimmer and the K3S

Tony Estep
In reply to this post by Don Wilhelm
On Sat, Sep 3, 2016 at 6:06 AM, Don Wilhelm <[hidden email]> wrote:

> ....It is not LP-Pan...

===============
As all the others have pointed out, the problem here has nothing to do with
LP-Pan. Using NaP3, for example, you can have a birdie-free display of
96Khz on either side, if your sound card is up to it and you set up the
software properly. Having tried both setups extensively, I can assure you
that you will get far superior performance from the combo of LP-Pan and
NaP3 than you will get from a Flex. It also is perfectly possible if you
know what you're doing to run NaP3 and Skimmer simultaneously.

Tony KT0NY
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Re: Skimmer and the K3S

Peter W2IRT
In reply to this post by Peter W2IRT
From: Tony Estep <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Skimmer and the K3S

===============
As all the others have pointed out, the problem here has nothing to do with
LP-Pan. Using NaP3, for example, you can have a birdie-free display of
96Khz on either side, if your sound card is up to it and you set up the
software properly. Having tried both setups extensively, I can assure you
that you will get far superior performance from the combo of LP-Pan and
NaP3 than you will get from a Flex. It also is perfectly possible if you
know what you're doing to run NaP3 and Skimmer simultaneously.

Tony KT0NY

[pjd] Except I don't really care about seeing a waterfall or having yet
*another* piece of software (NaP3) open unless it's absolutely required.
What I want is a box in the background to do the decoding of ~100 kHz worth
of signals at the bottom of the band my K3S is tuned to, feed the output of
that box into Skimmer and have the callsigns displayed on the N1MM+ bandmap
during contests. As I indicated earlier, I'm behind a mountain to Europe and
roughly half the RBN spots that get sent to my station aren't copyable or
aren't there, etc. A live local Skimmer will tell me what is coming to my
antenna and will save me time when I'm S&Ping, going only to known, copied
callsigns.

For finding the winning callsigns in a DXpedition pileup, just looking at
the Skimmer interface ought to be able to do that for me, no? I don't see
what NaP3 brings to the table in that regard.

My previous setup for a DXpedition pileup was to put the pileup on VFO-A,
the DX on SUB (locked), and see all the callers on Skimmer's interface. Find
the guy sending 5NN TU and pounce. The only problem was that everything from
about 4 to 6 kHz above the DX frequency gets obscured by the birdies/mirror
images on the skimmer display. And since most big DXpeditions split up, I
would lose a ton of callers in that murky no-man's land. The skimmer turned
out to be no help at all on some of the massive DXpeditions earlier this
spring as a result. The exception was Heard Island, who were split down,
rather than up. That worked like a champ on a few bands where the pileup was
insane.

I'm quite intrigued by the SDRplay box, and if anybody's using one I'd be
most grateful if they could contact me directly. If that can give me the
result I'm looking for (decoding the bottom of the currently tuned band),
then that's my next purchase.

Thanks again to everyone for your help.

73,
Peter, W2IRT

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73, Peter W2IRT
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Re: Skimmer and the K3S

briancom
In fact you can run both SKIMMER and the wider range panadapter software
off the same sound card.  At least is works in WIN7. YMMV with WIN8 and
WIN10.
I run SKIMMER and ROCKY simultaneously.

73 de Brian/K3KO

On 9/4/2016 13:50 PM, Peter W2IRT wrote:

> From: Tony Estep <[hidden email]>
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Skimmer and the K3S
>
> ===============
> As all the others have pointed out, the problem here has nothing to do with
> LP-Pan. Using NaP3, for example, you can have a birdie-free display of
> 96Khz on either side, if your sound card is up to it and you set up the
> software properly. Having tried both setups extensively, I can assure you
> that you will get far superior performance from the combo of LP-Pan and
> NaP3 than you will get from a Flex. It also is perfectly possible if you
> know what you're doing to run NaP3 and Skimmer simultaneously.
>
> Tony KT0NY
>
> [pjd] Except I don't really care about seeing a waterfall or having yet
> *another* piece of software (NaP3) open unless it's absolutely required.
> What I want is a box in the background to do the decoding of ~100 kHz worth
> of signals at the bottom of the band my K3S is tuned to, feed the output of
> that box into Skimmer and have the callsigns displayed on the N1MM+ bandmap
> during contests. As I indicated earlier, I'm behind a mountain to Europe and
> roughly half the RBN spots that get sent to my station aren't copyable or
> aren't there, etc. A live local Skimmer will tell me what is coming to my
> antenna and will save me time when I'm S&Ping, going only to known, copied
> callsigns.
>
> For finding the winning callsigns in a DXpedition pileup, just looking at
> the Skimmer interface ought to be able to do that for me, no? I don't see
> what NaP3 brings to the table in that regard.
>
> My previous setup for a DXpedition pileup was to put the pileup on VFO-A,
> the DX on SUB (locked), and see all the callers on Skimmer's interface. Find
> the guy sending 5NN TU and pounce. The only problem was that everything from
> about 4 to 6 kHz above the DX frequency gets obscured by the birdies/mirror
> images on the skimmer display. And since most big DXpeditions split up, I
> would lose a ton of callers in that murky no-man's land. The skimmer turned
> out to be no help at all on some of the massive DXpeditions earlier this
> spring as a result. The exception was Heard Island, who were split down,
> rather than up. That worked like a champ on a few bands where the pileup was
> insane.
>
> I'm quite intrigued by the SDRplay box, and if anybody's using one I'd be
> most grateful if they could contact me directly. If that can give me the
> result I'm looking for (decoding the bottom of the currently tuned band),
> then that's my next purchase.
>
> Thanks again to everyone for your help.
>
> 73,
> Peter, W2IRT
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>
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Re: Skimmer and the K3S

WB6DJI
In reply to this post by Peter W2IRT
Wish the K3S and Skimmer did this !

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=106&v=jjZ-l6v7gEI

73 Mike
WB6DJI
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Re: Skimmer and the K3S

N8LP
In reply to this post by Peter W2IRT
Running Router and LP-Bridge should not be a problem at all if Router is
properly configured. I ran this setup for a long time. Make sure you're
not asking both programs to create or use the same port. Also, make sure
both are using the latest major software release from Eltima (LPB and
Router both use Eltima drivers). I think it's 8.xx. Doesn't matter what
the minor revision levels are. Sometime Router can be picky about which
program was installed last because of pointers to the drivers. If you
installed LPB last, try reinstalling Router again.

I think the other issues have been well covered by others contributing
to this thread.

Sorry for the delayed response. I get the Digest version of the
reflector delivered a couple times a day.

73,
Larry N8LP


On 9/4/2016 2:28 AM, [hidden email] wrote:
> Message: 12
> Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2016 09:51:11 -0500
> From: Kevin<[hidden email]>
> To:[hidden email]
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Skimmer and the K3S
> Message-ID:<[hidden email]>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed
>
> Should read... Having them on most assuredly will.

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RE: Skimmer and the K3S

Peter W2IRT
In reply to this post by WB6DJI

Exactly. This is why the K3S and any conventional radio that comes after it is a Bad Decision for high-end operators. SO2R with one box, skimming everything, using only IP control. Remind me again why I just spent about $6,000 on an outdated design?
----------------------------------------------------

Regards,
Peter Dougherty, W2IRT

DXCC Card Checker/CQ-WAZ Checkpoint

www.facebook.com/W2IRT

 

From: WB6DJI [via Elecraft] [mailto:[hidden email]]
Sent: Sunday, September 04, 2016 12:17 PM
To: Peter W2IRT
Subject: Re: Skimmer and the K3S

 

Wish the K3S and Skimmer did this !

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=106&v=jjZ-l6v7gEI

73 Mike
WB6DJI
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Lovin' my K3S (S/N 10023)
73, Peter W2IRT
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Re: Skimmer and the K3S

Clay Autery
Whatever...  <smirk>

______________________
Clay Autery, KY5G
MONTAC Enterprises
(318) 518-1389

On 9/4/2016 11:29 PM, Peter W2IRT wrote:

> Exactly. This is why the K3S and any conventional radio that comes after it
> is a Bad Decision for high-end operators. SO2R with one box, skimming
> everything, using only IP control. Remind me again why I just spent about
> $6,000 on an outdated design?
> ----------------------------------------------------
>
> Regards,
> Peter Dougherty, W2IRT
>
> DXCC Card Checker/CQ-WAZ Checkpoint
>
> www.facebook.com/W2IRT
>
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R: Skimmer and the K3S

IK4EWX
In reply to this post by Peter W2IRT
Skimmer ultra assisted is real radio contesting or is a kind of automation that kill contesting? I think that this is not ham radio but another thing. I like my K3S with P3, I make qso unassisted, and I think THIS  is amateur radio.
73 de IK4EWX.

Invio eseguito dallo smartphone BlackBerry 10.
  Messaggio originale  
Da: Peter W2IRT
Inviato: lunedì 5 settembre 2016 06:30
A: [hidden email]
Oggetto: Re: [Elecraft] Skimmer and the K3S

Exactly. This is why the K3S and any conventional radio that comes after it
is a Bad Decision for high-end operators. SO2R with one box, skimming
everything, using only IP control. Remind me again why I just spent about
$6,000 on an outdated design?
----------------------------------------------------

Regards,
Peter Dougherty, W2IRT

DXCC Card Checker/CQ-WAZ Checkpoint

www.facebook.com/W2IRT



From: WB6DJI [via Elecraft]
[mailto:[hidden email]]
Sent: Sunday, September 04, 2016 12:17 PM
To: Peter W2IRT
Subject: Re: Skimmer and the K3S



Wish the K3S and Skimmer did this !

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=106
<https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=106&v=jjZ-l6v7gEI>
&v=jjZ-l6v7gEI

73 Mike
WB6DJI
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73, Peter W2IRT
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